12 replies to this topic

[Foogoo]

Assuming it's not in a well traveled area, will founding chambers be good for digging up a few weeks after they fly? Does the surface mound get obscured easily? Does the queen continue to dig deeper? In other words, is it worth traveling somewhere a few weeks after founding chambers were discovered?

[Michaelofvancouver]

In my captive colonies, I found that queens I put in dirt setups didn't dig deeper until a week after they get nanitics, so they probably won't be any deeper than when they first started their chamber. However, wind and such will probably have at least partially blown the mound away after a few weeks.

Edited by Michaelofvancouver, February 16 2015 - 9:28 PM.

[kellakk]

Also, the ground dries out and gets really hard after a few days in hot weather.  The top few inches can be extremely difficult to dig through.

[LAnt]

Automatically assuming the desert. I don't blame you.

[Foogoo]

Automatically assuming the desert. I don't blame you.

 

Yup. Sounds like it's probably not worth driving out there a few weeks after the rain.

[antsinmypants]

From my own personal experience digging up founding chambers in sandy soil last March, I would say that  in sandy soil after the last rain of the winter you would have no more than 3 weeks to find a nesting queen. The soil gets very hard, the tunnels are deeper and the tunnels may be more oriented sideways than vertical from the nesting entrance. But for the first 2 - 3 wks last spring, I was able to find many queens (61 or so). Since these queens were of the Pogonomyrmex variety, I caught at least a dozen or so with a pair of Dixie cups as they were out foraging.

[Foogoo]

From my own personal experience digging up founding chambers in sandy soil last March, I would say that  in sandy soil after the last rain of the winter you would have no more than 3 weeks to find a nesting queen. The soil gets very hard, the tunnels are deeper and the tunnels may be more oriented sideways than vertical from the nesting entrance. But for the first 2 - 3 wks last spring, I was able to find many queens (61 or so). Since these queens were of the Pogonomyrmex variety, I caught at least a dozen or so with a pair of Dixie cups as they were out foraging.

Was this in the Fresno area? That's a good point you bring up, that they'll still need to forage after digging their chamber.

[drtrmiller]

Also remember that the queen will likely have already exhausted her fat supplies laying eggs and feeding larvae after a few weeks.  So even if you get the queen, she's likely not going to be viable for independent colony founding unless you manage to carefully excavate the brood, or otherwise boost the queen.

[dspdrew]

I know for a fact that some queens do continue to dig deeper for days. They also backfill their holes. So it may only look like she has excavated only a small amount of dirt, when in reality she has dug a lot more, and just back filled her hole as she goes, all while the nest is closed up. Also the ground does dry out and harden.

 

Most of the founding chambers I  have dug up have been in the desert, and I can tell you for sure, that anymore than three days during the heat of the summer, and you will be lucky to find anything. Now Chromerust, kellakk, and I were just digging some up in the desert last week, and not only did we find a lot of queens, the ground was still very soft and wet. The rain fell a week before we were there. Gregory2455 went to the same location a week later, and even though he found lots of founding chambers, he ended up with hardly anything.

 

So in the middle of the summer in the desert when it's very hot, you have about three days. During the winter or early spring when it's still quite cool out, I would say you have probably a week before you're wasting your time and gas.

[antsinmypants]

 

From my own personal experience digging up founding chambers in sandy soil last March, I would say that  in sandy soil after the last rain of the winter you would have no more than 3 weeks to find a nesting queen. The soil gets very hard, the tunnels are deeper and the tunnels may be more oriented sideways than vertical from the nesting entrance. But for the first 2 - 3 wks last spring, I was able to find many queens (61 or so). Since these queens were of the Pogonomyrmex variety, I caught at least a dozen or so with a pair of Dixie cups as they were out foraging.

Was this in the Fresno area? That's a good point you bring up, that they'll still need to forage after digging their chamber.

 

Yes, this was the Fresno area. Right across Woodward Park. The park itself has more red Harvester ants right next to the
San Joaquin River. That said, I have found these ants at various areas in Fresno, including one house foreclosure where there were hundreds of 'em all over the front and backyards. I generally look for them over the white, sandy areas where I can easily see them.

[Foogoo]

I know for a fact that some queens do continue to dig deeper for days. They also backfill their holes. So it may only look like she has excavated only a small amount of dirt, when in reality she has dug a lot more, and just back filled her hole as she goes, all while the nest is closed up. Also the ground does dry out and harden.

 

Most of the founding chambers I  have dug up have been in the desert, and I can tell you for sure, that anymore than three days during the heat of the summer, and you will be lucky to find anything. Now Chromerust, kellakk, and I were just digging some up in the desert last week, and not only did we find a lot of queens, the ground was still very soft and wet. The rain fell a week before we were there. Gregory2455 went to the same location a week later, and even though he found lots of founding chambers, he ended up with hardly anything.

 

So in the middle of the summer in the desert when it's very hot, you have about three days. During the winter or early spring when it's still quite cool out, I would say you have probably a week before you're wasting your time and gas.

 

Excellent info, I'll stick to keeping track of the weather. It also seems like you've come across a number of queens wandering or outside their nest. Were there any particular circumstances? I don't think I've ever noticed that (other than with L. humile).

[dspdrew]

I would have to know exactly what you are referring to.

[Foogoo]

I would have to know exactly what you are referring to.

The Dorymyrmex queen you found at Chino a few weeks ago immediately comes to mind.