14 replies to this topic

[opezskiller]

So i have a theory, but it may not be practical.

 

Say someone had caught 2 different queens of the same species and grew the colony to the point of them producing alates. 

In any way would it be possible somehow to build a huge [censored] pexiglass formicarium in the backyard possibly 10x10ft. (obviously with a bottom) and say such species that you had kept were pogonomyrmex so they weren't able to climb out of the project. 

So finally you build two of them and you put them out in the backyard firstly digging the trench out (probably have to call digalert to make sure you don't hit anything important) as a safety precaution. 

Then they're finally completed you move the colonies in and what not and put some fluon so nothing intrudes upon them.

Now this part is the tricky part because i'm not sure if they will be able to mate with each other but you'd have to hoist a very thin holed net around it acting as a trap.

This would probably be very time consuming and but I've had this idea in my head for sometime now and was wondering if it somehow would be possible

 

if you have any questions on this please feel free to ask them

[nurbs]

Having a hard time visualizing what you want to do with the plexiglass and the trench. What is your endgame? Did you want the alates to mate in captivity? Is that your theory? If making this plexiglass nest would work?

 

Most antkeepers can't get Pogonomyrmex past the first year, much less create alates, so that should be your initial concern. You won't need a 10x10ft plexiglass for that. Get one of Drew's dirtshacks.

 

https://www.amazon.c...rt formicarium 

Edited by nurbs, January 14 2018 - 10:41 PM.

[opezskiller]

The species doesn’t necessarily matter I was ultimately thinking of an outdoor idea and if it would work to have two of the same species right next to each other and when they get the environmental queues they can fly off and mate with the other colony

[T.C.]

The species doesn’t necessarily matter I was ultimately thinking of an outdoor idea and if it would work to have two of the same species right next to each other and when they get the environmental queues they can fly off and mate with the other colony

Here's what I gather, you want to put two different ant species or two of the same species in formicariums which you place outside eo you can observe their nuptial flights and catch flying queens?

If so yes, it's possible, but the ants might move out if they have access to the outdoors. You wouldn't observe anything special that you couldn't observe in any other flight.

[opezskiller]

 

The species doesn’t necessarily matter I was ultimately thinking of an outdoor idea and if it would work to have two of the same species right next to each other and when they get the environmental queues they can fly off and mate with the other colony

Here's what I gather, you want to put two different ant species or two of the same species in formicariums which you place outside eo you can observe their nuptial flights and catch flying queens?

If so yes, it's possible, but the ants might move out if they have access to the outdoors. You wouldn't observe anything special that you couldn't observe in any other flight.

 

I don't care about observing anything it was more of an idea of having them mate and what not. They wouldn't be able to move out if its properly secured 

[T.C.]

 

 

The species doesn’t necessarily matter I was ultimately thinking of an outdoor idea and if it would work to have two of the same species right next to each other and when they get the environmental queues they can fly off and mate with the other colony

Here's what I gather, you want to put two different ant species or two of the same species in formicariums which you place outside eo you can observe their nuptial flights and catch flying queens?

If so yes, it's possible, but the ants might move out if they have access to the outdoors. You wouldn't observe anything special that you couldn't observe in any other flight.

 

I don't care about observing anything it was more of an idea of having them mate and what not. They wouldn't be able to move out if its properly secured 

 

Perhaps a net over the top of the formicariums of some sort?

[opezskiller]

 

 

 

The species doesn’t necessarily matter I was ultimately thinking of an outdoor idea and if it would work to have two of the same species right next to each other and when they get the environmental queues they can fly off and mate with the other colony

Here's what I gather, you want to put two different ant species or two of the same species in formicariums which you place outside eo you can observe their nuptial flights and catch flying queens?

If so yes, it's possible, but the ants might move out if they have access to the outdoors. You wouldn't observe anything special that you couldn't observe in any other flight.

 

I don't care about observing anything it was more of an idea of having them mate and what not. They wouldn't be able to move out if its properly secured 

 

Perhaps a net over the top of the formicariums of some sort?

 

no, 2 10x10 enclosures with a net around both of them(maybe a 1 foot gap)  enclosing them so when they fly the two colonies will mate with each other 

Edited by opezskiller, January 15 2018 - 10:45 PM.

[Loops117]

You can easily do this with a giant box, 2 colonies, and a spray bottle.

Trigger flight with spray bottle.

Take lids off both outworlds and place them in box.

The males will follow the scent trail regardless of flying or not. They will find their target.

I've watched males walk over to females and mount them without even a flutter of the wings. You don't need lots of space to mate ants, just patience.

 

 

The hard part isn't containing the mating, it's triggering the mating. You have to trigger two flights at the same time in order for it to work.

[Connectimyrmex]

Many ants can fly smooth vertical surfaces, so you would need a ton of chemical barriers.

[CNewton]

I think the problem with this post is everyone can seem to understand the "what" but fail to understand the "why". What you are talking about is, possibly, a multi-hundred dollar investment to have a nuptial flight. Are you studying the process of the flight, or simply want more queens? Unless you are working on an incredibly uncommon species or expect some kind of commercial demand, I cannot see it being more cost-effective than simply catching queens during natural flights.

[Connectimyrmex]

I think the problem with this post is everyone can seem to understand the "what" but fail to understand the "why". What you are talking about is, possibly, a multi-hundred dollar investment to have a nuptial flight. Are you studying the process of the flight, or simply want more queens? Unless you are working on an incredibly uncommon species or expect some kind of commercial demand, I cannot see it being more cost-effective than simply catching queens during natural flights.

I agree with CNewton.

[gcsnelling]

You can easily do this with a giant box, 2 colonies, and a spray bottle.

Trigger flight with spray bottle.

Take lids off both outworlds and place them in box.

The males will follow the scent trail regardless of flying or not. They will find their target.

I've watched males walk over to females and mount them without even a flutter of the wings. You don't need lots of space to mate ants, just patience.

 

 

The hard part isn't containing the mating, it's triggering the mating. You have to trigger two flights at the same time in order for it to work.

 

It is not as easy as you make it seem. There are a great many species which physically need to fly before they will mate successfully, even if the male couples with the female fertilization will not take place or will be weak. They often times need to mate with multiple males in order to be successful. My good friend Retroman on the board here has good luck getting his Pogonomyrmex  to mate but almost zero long term success getting them found new colonies. I suspect it is the lack of flight space.

I have not spoken to him recently but I know Drew stays in contact with him so he may have more input.

[opezskiller]

I think the problem with this post is everyone can seem to understand the "what" but fail to understand the "why". What you are talking about is, possibly, a multi-hundred dollar investment to have a nuptial flight. Are you studying the process of the flight, or simply want more queens? Unless you are working on an incredibly uncommon species or expect some kind of commercial demand, I cannot see it being more cost-effective than simply catching queens during natural flights.

I never exactly said I was going to do it in that way I was just saying that is it possible to do this to get the queens from the two that mated and starting a colony with the newly mated queens and getting that colony to a point where I will be able to breed them without inbreeding

[Loops117]

 

You can easily do this with a giant box, 2 colonies, and a spray bottle.

Trigger flight with spray bottle.

Take lids off both outworlds and place them in box.

The males will follow the scent trail regardless of flying or not. They will find their target.

I've watched males walk over to females and mount them without even a flutter of the wings. You don't need lots of space to mate ants, just patience.

 

 

The hard part isn't containing the mating, it's triggering the mating. You have to trigger two flights at the same time in order for it to work.

 

It is not as easy as you make it seem. There are a great many species which physically need to fly before they will mate successfully, even if the male couples with the female fertilization will not take place or will be weak. They often times need to mate with multiple males in order to be successful. My good friend Retroman on the board here has good luck getting his Pogonomyrmex  to mate but almost zero long term success getting them found new colonies. I suspect it is the lack of flight space.

I have not spoken to him recently but I know Drew stays in contact with him so he may have more input.

 

 

 did not know that about ants needing to physically fly before they can mate. Very interesting stuff that i'll have to look more into.

[opezskiller]

Well it depends on the species and colony