8 replies to this topic

[Saltynuts]

Does anyone know how to tell the difference between male and female alates in this species?  The best pictures I've seen are of the male and queen here:

 

http://www.antwiki.o...enopsis_invicta

 

I captured a small next for my indoor ant farm, and it has several alates.  But I can't tell them apart at all - they all look the same.  I imagine they all can't be male or female, there must be some mix in there!

 

My plan was to snag some alates out of another nest (when they say fire ants are an invasive species, they were not kidding - there are literally nests every meter or less), and try and put them together with the opposite sex from my nest.  Any reason this wouldn't work, if I could properly identify the males/females?  I guess even if I couldn't I could just put lost of pairs together randomly and it should work out 50% of the time.     Presumably they can mate before their nuptial flight?

 

Thanks for any help!

 

By the way, if helpful, I could probably snap pictures of my several alates and post them.

 

Thanks!

Edited by Saltynuts, May 25 2017 - 4:16 PM.

[Spamdy]

It is almost I'm possible to get ants to mate in captivity btw.

Edited by Spamdy, May 25 2017 - 4:25 PM.

[123LordOfAnts123]

Solenopsis is probably one of the easiest genera to differentiate males from females. S. invicta is no different.

Male top. Female below.




Most ant species, when in their reproductive phase, raise either one or the other sex to minimize the chances of inbreeding. That's not to say there can't be a mix, but a particular sex is normally favored.

As for "breeding" them, S. invicta only copulates in flight.

Edited by 123LordOfAnts123, May 25 2017 - 4:43 PM.

[Saltynuts]

Well hell, that put a damper in my day Spamdy!     Do they have any theories why that is?  Maybe during the time of their nuptial flights that is the only time when the ants' instincts not to tear the others' heads off is temporarily suspended just long enough to mate?  

[Saltynuts]

Thanks 123LordOfAnts123!  I'm having a problem opening that jpg - anyone else having a problem?  But I suppose that is why all the alates I look at look the same - they are all one sex or the other.

[Cameron C. Thomas]

If your general interest is in keeping S. invicta, you've found an incredibly easy species to collect and keep.

 

S. invicta flies many times over the spring, summer, and even into fall where they occur, especially where they're dense, so pay attention to flight conditions and you should have no problem collecting dealates to found a new colony.

 

Assuming you miss flights this year, wait until the end of the season and collect an entire colony, or do both if you like. S. invicta is incredibly easy to collect using drip extraction because of their rafting behavior. Follow this link for a blog post on just that: https://6legs2many.w...thod-fire-ants/

 

You don't need to create an intricate system for drip extraction. A laundry sink will work just fine if you want to do it one bucket at a time. For this species, one or two buckets will probably be enough to collect an entire colony. S. invicta in North America have become polygynous, so chances are you may nab a colony with several queens, which you could keep as is or split if you choose.

 

Good luck!

[Saltynuts]

LordofAnts, your picture came through now, thanks!  Mine are indeed all female I'm sure of it haha.  It makes so much sense now, I spent probably 30 minutes looking at like 7 or 8 alates trying to figure out why they all look alike!  

[Saltynuts]

Wow, Cameron, thanks so much. Very, very interesting!  A few questions.

 

What I did was literally find a fire and nest (wasn't hard haha), and dig it out (going a good ways underground to not miss the queen), and put the dirt and ants into a large round rubbermaid container.  I then put a heat lamp on one side to make sure the ants would move to the other.  Then I slowly with a hand spade (I think that is what it is called lol) shoveled dirt onto the top of another rubbermaid container and sifted through everything.  Pulled out tons of alates.  I also pulled out several alate looking ants without wings.  When I found the first one I assumed that was the queen.  But, I thought it was weird - none of the ants were paying much attention to her.  Finally, I shoveled out a bit of dirt that had tons of brood, and a HUGE concentration of ants in one place.  There was another wingless alate looking ant there.  Wherever she goes, tons of ants follow her and swarm around her at all times.  So I'm 99% sure that is the queen.

 

What might the other wingless alate-looking ants be?  I thought fire ants where generally one queen per colony.  Might those others be the sub-queens that can start new colonies?

 

And your drip method is basically a huge short-cut for my method correct?  I bet I killed more ants using my method than your drip method haha.

 

Thanks so much!

[Cameron C. Thomas]

Wow, Cameron, thanks so much. Very, very interesting!  A few questions.

 

What I did was literally find a fire and nest (wasn't hard haha), and dig it out (going a good ways underground to not miss the queen), and put the dirt and ants into a large round rubbermaid container.  I then put a heat lamp on one side to make sure the ants would move to the other.  Then I slowly with a hand spade (I think that is what it is called lol) shoveled dirt onto the top of another rubbermaid container and sifted through everything.  Pulled out tons of alates.  I also pulled out several alate looking ants without wings.  When I found the first one I assumed that was the queen.  But, I thought it was weird - none of the ants were paying much attention to her.  Finally, I shoveled out a bit of dirt that had tons of brood, and a HUGE concentration of ants in one place.  There was another wingless alate looking ant there.  Wherever she goes, tons of ants follow her and swarm around her at all times.  So I'm 99% sure that is the queen.

 

What might the other wingless alate-looking ants be?  I thought fire ants where generally one queen per colony.  Might those others be the sub-queens that can start new colonies?

 

And your drip method is basically a huge short-cut for my method correct?  I bet I killed more ants using my method than your drip method haha.

 

Thanks so much!

 

S. invicta colonies are monogynous where they're endemic, but many colonies are polygynous in North America, which has greatly benefited their expansion. It's very likely that a colony you collect will have multiple queens; but you may find other things as well. Some insects have evolved to coexist with ants, and even look like them! When I lived in Georgia, I would occasionally find rove beetles associated with ant colonies.

 

Drip extraction is certainly not my method, lol, but I do use a modified method for collecting one of the species I work with in Washginton. You should try it out for S. invicta. You are correct in that you'll probably kill far fewer ants, especially immature stages, using this method. It's best to wait until later in the season when most flights have occurred to collect colonies of this species, otherwise you'll probably end up with a ton of alates, which won't do you any good for keeping and will get everywhere if you do this inside.

 

Once you have a colony, and if it has multiple queens, you can certainly split them however you see fit; most, if not all, of the queens should actively reproduce. And most importantly, take notes! Communities of hobbyists like this one are incredibly beneficial, and you may develop an expertise in the species you keep which benefit others down the road.

Edited by Cameron C. Thomas, May 25 2017 - 10:59 PM.