16 replies to this topic

[JediPeaceFrog]

http://www.mirror.co...officer-8574786

[ctantkeeper]

This is supposed to be an ant keeping forum, right?

[Vendayn]

Well, this IS the off topic section.

 

But there should be a thread specifically for politics

[dspdrew]

I'm thinking of possibly dividing the off-topic subforum into more subforums, and maybe even excluding the off-topic subforum from the feed on the front page, since it is of significantly less importance here than ant, or even any biology-related topics. I don't want to silence anyone's opinions, but I think they should probably have to be specifically sought out (like going to the specific subforum) if they are not related to the topic of the forum.

[drtrmiller]

The premise of this topic is borderline hate speech. There is a line, somewhere, and I think it has been crossed.

I am repulsed by Jedi's heinous and increasingly chronic demagoguery, and I repudiate it unequivocally. There is no place for hate speech in this forum.

Topic locked.

Edited by drtrmiller, August 6 2016 - 3:56 PM.

[Batspiderfish]

It is hate speech, by definition.

[dspdrew]

The premise of this topic is borderline hate speech. There is a line, somewhere, and I think it has been crossed.

I am repulsed by Jedi's heinous and increasingly chronic demagoguery, and I repudiate it unequivocally. There is no place for hate speech in this forum.

Topic locked.

 

You're a moderator now?

[Alza]

I'm with him on this one dsp. 

[ctantkeeper]

me too, btw I actually thought he was an admin of some sort lol

[altmoola]

I am repulsed by Jedi's heinous and increasingly chronic demagoguery, and I repudiate it unequivocally.

 

Man, you embody an /r/iamverysmart post.

Edited by altmoola, August 8 2016 - 3:08 PM.

[Batspiderfish]

I'm pretty sure the forum needs a hate speech policy, or at least a place in where nobody has to look these topics unless they want to. We can call it "The Garbage".

Seriously, though, these posts will drive away Muslim ant keepers and any experts/advanced enthusiasts who think about it hard enough to notice and oppose hate speech. There is a line between letting people express themselves and creating an openly hostile environment for an entire group of human beings. My principles are important to me and I want to use a forum which draws that line. 

[dspdrew]

This forum has its rules on what can and can't be posted. I happen to be a strong supporter of free speech, so the rules here almost exclusively deal with the presentation or manner in which people's messages and ideas are put forth, and not with the content itself. Everybody has their opinions, some popular, and some unpopular. Some might even come out of complete ignorance, but the posts are their posts, and nobody else's. Anyone who disagrees or has an issue with what another member posts has every opportunity to post their own reply, or just ignore it outright. Most people who have been on this forum since its beginning already know this. There's a lot more freedom here than there is on most forums, with their mile long lists of rules, and I know for a fact that that is one of the main reasons for this forum's popularity.

 

Now of course this is an ant/myrmecology forum, so obviously entire topics not related to ants, or any of the popular subjects that most people in this community are interested in are of less value here, which is why I am thinking of removing them from the "Latest Posts" feed on the front page.

[MrmrGatlin]

My thing is, it's ok to have your own viewpoints and even have civil discussion on an ant forum. What gets me is that there's a new thread almost every week it seems. it's just too much from my perspective. If you really must rant, keep it in the same thread.

[gcsnelling]

I generally do not get involved with non ant related topics. However as much as I support a persons right to free speech, I believe this is absolutely not the place for topics which strongly border or even cross the line into hate speech. Topics of this sort should be squelched/locked immediately, and allowed to get buried or deleted. Any person who continually makes these sort of posts after being warned should be shown the door if they continue.

[Chad W]

hate is subjective. if you don't like the conversation, remove yourself from it.

[drtrmiller]

I truly hate to give this topic any more attention, as it deserves to be buried.  However, I feel it is my duty to speak up for reasonable people who may not have the words or energy to sufficiently convey why these topics should not exist here, in this forum.

While the American Bar Association does characterize hate speech as any speech which "offends, threatens, or insults groups, based on race, color, religion, national origin, sexual orientation, disability, or other traits"—which is clearly the intent of the title of this thread—the speech itself is not the reason it should be removed or censored/edited out of this forum—but rather the nature of the forum, itself.

When I was at university, I studied a number of Supreme Court Cases, one of which was Hazelwood v. Kuhlmeier (full opinion).  While not involving hate speech, I find this case particularly relevant here: a student-run publication at a public school featured a section about a student's experience with divorced parents, as well as a story about a pregnant teen within the school.  The principal quashed the story, fearing that other students may be able to identify the ones written about in the article, and the student writers took the case to court on 1st Amendment grounds.

 

The US Supreme Court ruled that the school did not impose upon the student's right to free speech—and by the heavily conservative Rehnquist court, nonetheless!  The court reasoned that the school was not considered a full public forum, indiscriminately open to all views, but rather served as a limited forum, where speech must have some limitations in light of the school environment.

 

Similarly, Formiculture.com was never established as a forum for anyone to express his or her view about any topic without censure—other websites exist for that.  Formiculture is a limited forum to primarily discuss ants and insect-related topics.  In the past, topics have been locked, such as one that discussed the behavior of an individual from another forum.

In examining the forum rules, themselves, we continue to find clear evidence that Formiculture.com was never established to be a forum for completely unfettered discussion of any topic:

1. Formiculture.com reserves the right to remove, edit, move or close any thread for any reason.

3. No posting any messages that are obscene, indecent, profane, vulgar, sexually oriented, or violate any US laws.

6. No posting any deliberately false or misleading information.

 

Now, let's examine the writing at hand: the title of this thread contains the text, "Invasion of 'peaceful' Muslims has REALLY made Europe a better place, hasn't it?"  The title is nothing less than a denigrating, sarcastic jab at an entire class of people—in this case, based on an entire religion and national origin.  Specifically, the author begins by mischaracterizing emigration or refugees fleeing war-torn zones as an "invasion," which is primarily a military term. Then, the author uses sarcastic quotes around "peaceful," to imply that the subject, all Muslims, are incapable of being peaceful.

In light of near-universal controversy over this topic, inaction here is tantamount to an endorsement by the forum and forum owner to the offensive claims.  Consequently, this topic serves no educational or other purpose but to deter individuals within the directed classes—and other sympathetic bystanders, such as myself and many who have dissented to such language, here—from participating in this limited forum.

It is for these reasons that this topic, and any similar topics or posts directed toward an entire class, should be repudiated by forum staff by locking, hiding, or otherwise editing out the offending content when a genuine controversy arises.

Edited by drtrmiller, August 9 2016 - 5:00 AM.

[dspdrew]

Nice try Terry. I was waiting for the first person to try the "if he doesn't take our side, then he must be endorsing the other". Wrong. This has nothing to do with my own views on anything. It amazes me how people who have the biggest problem with someone's opinions continue to put them right back in the light by continuing to reply to the topic. Chad said it best. If you don't like the conversation, remove yourself from it. Apparently some people don't have the self-control to do that, so I will do it for them. The topic is now locked. Congratulations. Cause enough of a scene, and yes, like some others in the past it will be locked. Not removed, but locked to put an end to the discussion. Sort of like how protesters sometimes silence speeches from people they disagree with by causing so much trouble, they have to shut down the event.