18 replies to this topic

[floam90s13]

1. Arizona City, Az
2. July 1st 2016
3. The black queen (crematogaster?) was on my window screen, the winged orange (camponotus?) was on my brick wall under the same light, the wingless orange one was running around avoiding what I believe are Pogonomyrmex Rugosus just outside my wall.
4. Black on is 7mm, orange ones 8-9mm
5. What you see is what you get. My eyes are worse than the pictures I'll post.
6. See above
7. Black one doesn't seem to mind when I look at her nearly as much as the orange ones. They freak the [censored] out. The orange ones were also restless for the first day in the test tube where as the black one just tended to her eggs (she laid some in a container before I got test tubes).
8. NA
9. As stated above this is the black queen in a rubber maid container before I got test tubes. She dumped 2 of her wings and laid some eggs. She now has what looks like 2 larvae and around 15-20 eggs.


This orange queen has somewhere between 7-12 eggs now.


The second orange queen is identical to the above pictures but with wings. I apologize I don't have more pictures, all I have is an iPhone currently. She had more eggs but her cotton molded and she ate the affected eggs after I transferred her to a clean tube. She now has 4-8 eggs.

I had these as well, but was told they were wasps. I was hoping they were Pogonomyrmex Rugosus, that's my dream to have a colony of them.


So let me know what you guys think. Any and all help is appreciated.

-Aaron

Edited by dspdrew, July 21 2016 - 10:37 AM.
Removed profanity

[dspdrew]

First one is Crematogaster sp..

Second one looks like one of the smaller Camponotus species of the Festinatus complex.

Third is Pogonomyrmex rugosus.

[Batspiderfish]

Wanna show that picture of the third "queen's" mandibles?

[floam90s13]

First one is Crematogaster sp..

Second one looks like one of the smaller Camponotus species of the Festinatus complex.

Third is Pogonomyrmex rugosus.

 

Well I am pretty pissed off if let my dream queen go. They weren't doing well, however. Out of the 5 I caught 4 died and I dumped the last one 2 nights ago. I knew I should have gotten a second opinion regarding what they were. Or better pictures. I hear the P. Rugosus is fully claustral? I thought maybe they hated the tubes because they couldn't forage, but I remember seeing that they are one of the few Pogonomyrmex that don't? Idk, still new to all of this. None of them ever laid any eggs, but I know some queens don't for up to and over a month given what I have read.

 

I thought maybe the Camponotus was Fragilus. I guess these are similar but smaller? Or a desert variety?

 

Wanna show that picture of the third "queen's" mandibles?

 

I will when I get home from work. I can't access photobucket here.

 

Thank you both for your response.

Edited by floam90s13, July 21 2016 - 10:55 AM.

[dspdrew]

Pogonomyrmex rugosus don't seem to do very well usually. In my experience, and what I've heard from others, it's common for them to not lay any eggs, or very few eggs. They seem to be very slow growing in captivity at first, but can start to grow pretty fast after nine months or so.

 

Camponotus fragilis are a medium-sized Camponotus species. Here (http://www.formiculture.com/topic/488-) is my old ID thread from back when I first caught a C. fragilis queen.

[floam90s13]

Now that I see your thread where it gives the size, my queens are 3/4 the size roughly. When I went out last night looking for queens I believe I saw some workers from a wild colony. I grabbed a Major, I'll throw a picture up later to confirm and give a size.

 

As for the P. Rugosus, if I did let one go I hope to find another. I will post more pictures when I get home as previously stated, but I think the antenna and jaws are both off. I will actually look for the body of the one that died and see if I can get better shots.

[dspdrew]

I wasn't sure if your measurements were correct, but if they're that small, then I'm not sure what species they are. Maybe one of the experts knows.

 

I'm sure you'll find more P. rugosus. In the Mojave Desert in California, where I go out looking, those things seem to fly almost every time it rains. They have by far been the most abundant queens I've seen out there.

[floam90s13]

That is the most accurate Measurement I can get. They are visibly larger than the Crematogaster, but not that much bigger.

 

Near my house I have never seen any other color of Pogonomyrmex. No red, bicolor, nada. Just black. Honestly I would take any Pogonomyrmex, and be very happy, though.

[dspdrew]

If the Camponotus are larger than the Crematogaster, then I think they may be within the size range of C. fragilis.

[Canadian anter]

You probably know this, but in case you don't.

All ants have elbowed antennae. It's slightly less visible in alates(in my experience)

[Batspiderfish]

You probably know this, but in case you don't.

All ants have elbowed antennae. It's slightly less visible in alates(in my experience)

 

Only on the males can it be difficult to tell. Queen antennae are just as distinctly elbowed as the workers.

[floam90s13]

You probably know this, but in case you don't.
All ants have elbowed antennae. It's slightly less visible in alates(in my experience)

 
Only on the males can it be difficult to tell. Queen antennae are just as distinctly elbowed as the workers.

I was told originally that they were wasps or something because they had straight antenna. Their jaws don't look very ant like either. These are all the pictures I have of the imposters.

[Batspiderfish]

Seeing underneath the wings for the first time, in the last picture (what appears to be two petioles), I am open to the possibility of this being a Pogonomyrmex male. The mandibles, antennae, and general shape make me very reluctant to call this an ant, but I cannot find any male wasp specimens with that abdominal configuration (I suspected some sort of male Mutilidae).

I reason that it is not a queen for its wasp-like appearance, and that Pogonomyrmex rugosus females have square heads and blunt mandibles. Males can be quite hairy, as this specimen appears to be, but at best the mandibles look to be slender. You might want to bring this to the attention of James Trager, or pass all the relevant photographs through bugguide.

Edited by Batspiderfish, July 22 2016 - 6:23 PM.

[gcsnelling]

This is an ant, Period.

[Batspiderfish]

What do you think about Pogonomyrmex colei?

 

I'm probably getting ahead of myself. I'm not familiar enough with Pogonomyrmex to be making assumptions like that. Those mandibles are just fantastic.

Edited by Batspiderfish, July 22 2016 - 7:20 PM.

[dspdrew]

I didn't realize it looked that much like a male 'till now. In that case, I think it could be a number of different species.

[Mdrogun]

The ant in the third picture reminds me a lot of Polyergus.

[gcsnelling]

Nowhere near hairy enough to be P. colei. Dark as it is it is almost certainly P. rugosus which can be quite variable in color.

[dspdrew]

Nowhere near hairy enough to be P. colei. Dark as it is it is almost certainly P. rugosus which can be quite variable in color.

 

Do you think it's a male, or female?