26 replies to this topic

[mete]

Is the previous host of a parasitic mite to ants always an animal (a live insect etc) ? or they can travel to the outworld with anything like food containers or non-insect food (seeds etc) ?

[ANTdrew]

Wild caught insects could possibly carry parasitic mites into a formicarium. Commercially raised feeder insects are also frequently infested with trash eating mites. This is why all insects should be flash boiled for at least three seconds before feeding to your ants. 

[mete]

What about non-animal things ? For example (organic) seeds sold for planting or inanimate things like food/water containers.

[ANTdrew]

There is almost no chance parasitic mites will get in via those items. Trash mites could be in old grain, though.

[mete]

OK I see. Are trash mites dangerous for ants ?

[ANTdrew]

They are irritating and repulsive. You should avoid them at all costs.

[dspdrew]

They are irritating and repulsive. You should avoid them at all costs.

 

That is pretty much the best description of grain mites.

[mete]

So I guess it means any seeds/grains that are not specifically sold for ants or are not for human consumption has to be boiled before.

[Ernteameise]

So I guess it means any seeds/grains that are not specifically sold for ants or are not for human consumption has to be boiled before.

Nah, nobody boils seeds for ants (at least I have not heard of this).

It is the insects you should boil for a few seconds.

You should just pay attention which seed you buy.

Better spend more money than causing harm.

Another issue with seed is that some seed you buy (either seed for gardening or seed sold for birds) can be treated with insecticides (to kill the mites!) and this can wipe out your ant colony if you feed these seed.

Better spend some more money to buy seed from a trusted source.

Otherwise, you will have to live with the risk.

Edited by Ernteameise, September 18 2024 - 9:37 AM.

[mete]

So I guess it means any seeds/grains that are not specifically sold for ants or are not for human consumption has to be boiled before.

Nah, nobody boils seeds for ants (at least I have not heard of this).
It is the insects you should boil for a few seconds.
You should just pay attention which seed you buy.
Better spend more money than causing harm.
Another issue with seed is that some seed you buy (either seed for gardening or seed sold for birds) can be treated with insecticides (to kill the mites!) and this can wipe out your ant colony if you feed these seed.
Better spend some more money to buy seed from a trusted source.
Otherwise, you will have to live with the risk.

I am thinking to use bio seeds for gardening to increase insect/butterfly/bee activity. I guess this eliminates insecticides issue ? But then may not eliminate the mites issue hence I consider boiling.

Trusted source to buy seeds specifically sold as ant food ?

[mbullock42086]

commercially reared mealworms and fruitflies are all 100% infested with grain mites.  

  these big companies cut costs, use corn meal based medium, and as a result big time mite issues.

Avoid anything with millet, that's the worst one of all.

[Mushu]

commercially reared mealworms and fruitflies are all 100% infested with grain mites.  

  these big companies cut costs, use corn meal based medium, and as a result big time mite issues.

Avoid anything with millet, that's the worst one of all.

I'm not sure about their mealworms, but Josh's frog does treat mites before seeding their fruit fly cultures, however the fruit fly media eventually may get a mite egg to survive. I always use boiling water on the media, but you can't mix it 100% all the time. 

[Barristan]

Mites are almost everywhere also in your house (house dust mites).

Feeder insects can sometimes contain a lot of mites (like the last crickets I bought...) but in most cases you'll find the harmless mites that just feed on leftover food and other small debris that contains protein.

Mites are also excellent climbers, they can run up smooth surfaces and since they are so tiny they can slip through tiny gaps. You can also get mites through their eggs. The eggs are even smaller and if at least 1 female and 1 male mite hatch from them the mites will multiply... So 1 female mated mite would also be enough to start a mite infestation...

Keep your outworld dry and moisturize the nest only as much as needed for the ants.

There is also some speculation if lack of UV light is the cause that especially non parasitic mites thrive so much in outworlds. Since ants don't require UV light, most ant keepers don't use special reptile lamps. Non parasitic mites often live in darkness and UV light would probably be quite harmful to them. But this has to be tested...

Edited by Barristan, September 18 2024 - 9:22 PM.

[Ernteameise]

 

 

So I guess it means any seeds/grains that are not specifically sold for ants or are not for human consumption has to be boiled before.

Nah, nobody boils seeds for ants (at least I have not heard of this).
It is the insects you should boil for a few seconds.
You should just pay attention which seed you buy.
Better spend more money than causing harm.
Another issue with seed is that some seed you buy (either seed for gardening or seed sold for birds) can be treated with insecticides (to kill the mites!) and this can wipe out your ant colony if you feed these seed.
Better spend some more money to buy seed from a trusted source.
Otherwise, you will have to live with the risk.

I am thinking to use bio seeds for gardening to increase insect/butterfly/bee activity. I guess this eliminates insecticides issue ? But then may not eliminate the mites issue hence I consider boiling.

Trusted source to buy seeds specifically sold as ant food ?

 

Well, trusted sources are the usual suspects.

I bought from the AntStore and the Spanish company Ant House. Yes, this is expensive. But so far I had no problems with their seed.

I especially recommend Ant House, since they have great customer service, the prices are decent and the delivery to Germany is sometimes faster than AntStore (which is situated in Berlin).

I also bought bulk seed (canary, budgie) from Fressnapf, a German pet store (not sure you have them in Switzerland?). In Fressnapf, they have bins where diverse pet food items are, and you can just fill up your bag.

Do not buy too much, because it will spoil before you can feed it to your ants. If stored longer, do a smell test and throw out any seed that smell rancid. This is unhealthy for animals and humans alike.

I also have not noticed any issues with the bulk seed.

I personally avoid bird seed in colorful packaging, since I have heard that this is often treated.

Same is true for sand also- I only buy my ant sand from one of the online ant shops, reptile and bird sand is often treated for mites and will kill your ants.

 

EDIT- I would also not trust "organic" garden seed. Some of these could be treated with organic stuff like the bacteria Bacillus thurigensis, which is an organic way of killing insects. It is used to kill mosquito larvae, for example, after floodings and infestations. If in doubt, contact the producer if their seed are treated, the people in the store won't know. These seed are fine for buttlerflies, because they will visit the flowers, and not eat the seed which you plant in the ground.

Edited by Ernteameise, September 18 2024 - 11:00 PM.

[mete]

Well, trusted sources are the usual suspects.

 

I bought from the AntStore and the Spanish company Ant House. Yes, this is expensive. But so far I had no problems with their seed.

I especially recommend Ant House, since they have great customer service, the prices are decent and the delivery to Germany is sometimes faster than AntStore (which is situated in Berlin).

I also bought bulk seed (canary, budgie) from Fressnapf, a German pet store (not sure you have them in Switzerland?). In Fressnapf, they have bins where diverse pet food items are, and you can just fill up your bag.

Do not buy too much, because it will spoil before you can feed it to your ants. If stored longer, do a smell test and throw out any seed that smell rancid. This is unhealthy for animals and humans alike.

I also have not noticed any issues with the bulk seed.

I personally avoid bird seed in colorful packaging, since I have heard that this is often treated.

Same is true for sand also- I only buy my ant sand from one of the online ant shops, reptile and bird sand is often treated for mites and will kill your ants.

 

EDIT- I would also not trust "organic" garden seed. Some of these could be treated with organic stuff like the bacteria Bacillus thurigensis, which is an organic way of killing insects. It is used to kill mosquito larvae, for example, after floodings and infestations. If in doubt, contact the producer if their seed are treated, the people in the store won't know. These seed are fine for buttlerflies, because they will visit the flowers, and not eat the seed which you plant in the ground.

 

OK I see, then I guess it is best for me at least at the moment to use only ant specific products. I was wondering about the thing you mentioned about organic seeds if they may contain something for "organic way of killing insects", thanks for pointing this out. Just out of curiosity, I might ask this to the manufacturer.

 

Is there any risk to use organic seeds/grains sold for human consumption (chia etc.) ?

 

AntStore has a representative/distributor in Switzerland. It is I guess more expensive than Germany, not sure if they have all products and the delivery takes a bit longer but it is probably the only way to get (live) colonies (not sure but I don't think they can be shipped by post from Germany to here). For seeds, it is probably simpler so I will check Ant House also. I also didn't know but it seems Fressnapf also has a presence in Switzerland, products might be different though, I will check.

[mete]

There is also some speculation if lack of UV light is the cause that especially non parasitic mites thrive so much in outworlds. Since ants don't require UV light, most ant keepers don't use special reptile lamps. Non parasitic mites often live in darkness and UV light would probably be quite harmful to them. But this has to be tested...

 

Very interesting

[ANTdrew]

I’m sensing a lot of anxiety from your end. Try to relax and not worry too much about every potential risk. Ants dominate every terrestrial habitat on earth for a reason. They are rugged survivors, not some faerie beings in need of our protection. Keeping ants should be fun, not stress inducing.

[mete]

I’m sensing a lot of anxiety from your end. Try to relax and not worry too much about every potential risk. Ants dominate every terrestrial habitat on earth for a reason. They are rugged survivors, not some faerie beings in need of our protection. Keeping ants should be fun, not stress inducing.

thanks for the concern. Not much, but ok might be a little stressed not to do something fatally wrong. I am more curious than stressed actually, hence the questions.

[Full_Frontal_Yeti]

So I guess it means any seeds/grains that are not specifically sold for ants or are not for human consumption has to be boiled before.

No not like that not.
 

Insects = boil to kill off any mites or mite eggs that may on them already.

 

purchased food seeds/garden seeds/fresh organic fruit seeds (blueberries/strawberries/etc) = the trash pile of seed husks/seed stores in the nest, may attract/become a home for grain mites which can harm the health of the colony.

food grade or garden planting purchased seeds/purchased ant food seeds, should not be a source of introducing any contaminates, no need to clean them before introduction.

But i do make sure to clean up the trash pile with regular frequency to avoid providing a home for grain mites.

Though i do allow the ants to keep some amount of seed larder in their nest. I'd be fairly sure it is a signal of poor foraging/living conditions to their POV, if they can't build up some amount of larder.

[mete]

 

So I guess it means any seeds/grains that are not specifically sold for ants or are not for human consumption has to be boiled before.

No not like that not.
 

Insects = boil to kill off any mites or mite eggs that may on them already.

 

purchased food seeds/garden seeds/fresh organic fruit seeds (blueberries/strawberries/etc) = the trash pile of seed husks/seed stores in the nest, may attract/become a home for grain mites which can harm the health of the colony.

food grade or garden planting purchased seeds/purchased ant food seeds, should not be a source of introducing any contaminates, no need to clean them before introduction.

But i do make sure to clean up the trash pile with regular frequency to avoid providing a home for grain mites.

Though i do allow the ants to keep some amount of seed larder in their nest. I'd be fairly sure it is a signal of poor foraging/living conditions to their POV, if they can't build up some amount of larder.

 

 

OK got it. I can't do anything (clean etc.) about the nest, it is a closed structure but I do try to clean the outworld once a week or so.