10 replies to this topic

[Vendayn]

Habitat: chaparral.
Location: Ramona, east county San Diego sort of close to the mountains.

 

They are nesting in middle of the trail, very hard soil when dry.

 

Appearance: Very bright red workers, however queens are almost an orange color. The queens themselves are pretty small, along with the workers. Pogonomyrmex californicus are much bigger. These ones are maybe half the size.

 

Nests are just an open hole about a quarter in size, with a low lying mound around it that they piled food and dirts on.

 

They were/are having their mating flight today, too. Except it started raining. Strangely, I found a wingless queen taking part in the activity and was amongst the workers and other alates. I've seen this species once before up in Del Mar, and I remember seeing a wingless queen also outside their nest entrance when they were having their mating flight. Seems to be a thing with this species. Maybe the queen takes part in the action for some strange reason? Seems a weird trait to have.

 

They are also not aggressive at all. I can open their container lid they are in, and they just keep on digging. They don't suddenly all run around angrily looking for something to sting. It could be the colder weather today, though. But, even then, Pogonomyrmex californicus are still way more aggressive than this species is.

 

I'll attempt to get pictures, but they might not come out too good. The Veromessor are MUCH bigger and it still didn't come out that great. These would be even harder because of their color. Hopefully in this case, a description works good enoough. I don't imagine there are many small Pogonomyrmex who have queen(s) join in on their mating flights. Nor fly this late in the year.

Edited by Vendayn, October 5 2015 - 9:09 AM.

[Vendayn]

Looking at the mating chart, only...

 

Pogonomyrmex subdentatus

 

fly in October. They do look like an exact match too. Is that a best of a guess as any?

[dspdrew]

I don't think P. subdentatus are found that far south. You would probably need much better pictures, if not a microscope to ID them. Based on the habitat, my first guess would be P. subnitidus, or P. californicus, but they fly in June and July.

[Vendayn]

Definitely not P. californicus. The workers and queens are smaller than P. californicus workers (about half the size), and are almost an orange color. They could be P. subnitidus, as the colony did seem a bit on the big side for P. subdentatus. I'm not sure how big/small P. subnitidus are though.

[dspdrew]

Half the size of P. californicus would be about 3 mm. That would be very small for a mature Pogonomyrmex worker.

[Vendayn]

I measured them. They are 3-5 MM long. And the queen is about 4-6 MM long. Some of the workers are a bit on the small side for Pogonomyrmex. They look and measure to be smaller than P. californicus. They look like what I thought were Pogonomyrmex up on Palomar Mountain, which were kinda small as well for Pogonomyrmex. In fact, they are almost an exact match for the ones I saw up there before the huge fires. And, I've seen a similar species in Del Mar in a canyon area, which were more on the smaller side as well. I wonder if they are even Pogonomyrmex then. The queens and workers look about the same for Pogonomyrmex, just a bit smaller.

 

Also, why would a wingless queen be out with the workers and winged alates? I wonder if she is even fertile. Seems weird to go out of the nest if she is an actual queen.

Edited by Vendayn, October 5 2015 - 11:50 AM.

[gcsnelling]

P. subnitidus almost for surw. Look for epinotal spines. Not unusual for late seaon virgin queens to shed wings and act ad workers.

[Vendayn]

http://s4.photobucke.../Mobile Uploads

First three pictures.

Thanks for the ID. so, the female I found is probably not even fertile then?

[gcsnelling]

likely not.

[Vendayn]

Ah. Well, I put her (and the rest of the workers) back. No point in keeping her if she isn't fertile, plus if she is, I don't want to destroy the colony. I got Forelius pruinosus/mccooki instead, to along with my Veromessor.

[Alza]

Californicus and subnitidus are the same size, and the nanitics groww larger as the generations pass. Also queens vary in size greatly even within their own species.