12 replies to this topic

[Koafid]

So I mixed technical alcohol with baby powder, it made paste, which I put on walls on my homemade formicarium, it did solidified into what you see on photo.
And just now I saw 1 ant going on the lit that is placed on top of those glass walls.
What's wrong?

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[ReignofRage]

Look at the ingredients to make sure the baby powder is talcum powder and not corn starch. If it is talcum powder, add a little bit more alcohol to make it thinner and easily spreadable. When spreading it, try to make a consistent band that has a consistent of a layer thickness, and avoid any clumps. Some people dry-apply talcum powder, but that method requires very frequent applications depending on if your ants try the barrier a lot or not. It can also be difficult to dry-apply talcum powder as well. 

[Koafid]

it has not corn starch, but it sometimes had tendency to pour down, so I did it with finger, that's cause of that inconsistency. so I should put there twice as much, so there is everywhere that thick layer and make it a bit less fluid, so I put it and it sticks? when I had it more rigid, I applied it and it started to crumble when I moved the container.

Look at the ingredients to make sure the baby powder is talcum powder and not corn starch. If it is talcum powder, add a little bit more alcohol to make it thinner and easily spreadable. When spreading it, try to make a consistent band that has a consistent of a layer thickness, and avoid any clumps. Some people dry-apply talcum powder, but that method requires very frequent applications depending on if your ants try the barrier a lot or not. It can also be difficult to dry-apply talcum powder as well. 

[Full_Frontal_Yeti]

 

it has not corn starch, but it sometimes had tendency to pour down, so I did it with finger, that's cause of that inconsistency. so I should put there twice as much, so there is everywhere that thick layer and make it a bit less fluid, so I put it and it sticks? when I had it more rigid, I applied it and it started to crumble when I moved the container.

I think the intended result is that the talc powder is just barely clinging to the side wall after the alcohol evaporates. It should easy fall off so that any ant attempting to walk across it will simply fall off with whatever bits of talc stuck to them instead of the sidewall/other talc.

I've not used this yet myself but if like fluon, i understand it works best when put on in an more even coat. And thick enough you can know the ant trying to cling to the talc powder is just going to pull it off the side wall with their weight rather than be able to climb over it.

I imagine if its a bit watery/sticky they might be able to climb across it. or if it is thin enough they get some purchase on the glass directly.

Antdrew uses this method specifically. I'll see if i can cast summon @ANTdrew for you for better details..

[ANTdrew]

Paint a thicker barrier. You need a consistent coating.

[SHmealer]

sorry if this is somewhat off topic, but i couldn't help but notice the setup. Are they supposed to be nesting in the soil? if so it looks much too loose and dry.. If you want them to live in it your gonna want to water and compact it

[rockaedward]

the barrier looks generally poorly applied, which definitely isn't doing it any favors. Try to use a tool like a cotton ball, or q-tip to apply it. It's also really thick and clumpy. Try to dilute it more next time. It shouldn't have a pasty consistency.  I recommend practicing on a spare container or something. In the meantime, unless your colony is too big for a tube, you can just keep them in a closed tube for now

Edited by rockaedward, June 4 2024 - 1:26 PM.

[Koafid]

sorry if this is somewhat off topic, but i couldn't help but notice the setup. Are they supposed to be nesting in the soil? if so it looks much too loose and dry.. If you want them to live in it your gonna want to water and compact it

just once? or every week or so? how many water? 0,02l? (small shot)? it's lasius niger, room around 20°C, more humid (150y old house, ground floor)

[Koafid]

I used ear cleaner, that made two separate layers, which than I needed to somehow connect/spred. wouldn't cotton ball just absorb all of it? also is there any guide showing just how much fluid it should be and how should the result look, or something like that? thanks

the barrier looks generally poorly applied, which definitely isn't doing it any favors. Try to use a tool like a cotton ball, or q-tip to apply it. It's also really thick and clumpy. Try to dilute it more next time. It shouldn't have a pasty consistency.  I recommend practicing on a spare container or something. In the meantime, unless your colony is too big for a tube, you can just keep them in a closed tube for now

[Stubyvast]

I think that a cotton ball would still work, because when you squeeze it, it would apply evenly to the surface as it is released. As to the thickness, I'd say you probably need another solid inch there. Yes probably a more liquid consistency would help, from what I've seen (although personally I just use vaseline, which works just fine). To be honest though, I'd say more parts oil than baby powder, to get that more liquidy consistency. Think: Cream, not Toothpaste. haha. Then it should dry and become super slippery for your ants. Good luck!

[ANTdrew]

I think that a cotton ball would still work, because when you squeeze it, it would apply evenly to the surface as it is released. As to the thickness, I'd say you probably need another solid inch there. Yes probably a more liquid consistency would help, from what I've seen (although personally I just use vaseline, which works just fine). To be honest though, I'd say more parts oil than baby powder, to get that more liquidy consistency. Think: Cream, not Toothpaste. haha. Then it should dry and become super slippery for your ants. Good luck!

Mix alcohol with the talc, not baby oil!

[Full_Frontal_Yeti]

I believe Stubyvast and ANTdrew are describing two different kinds of talc using barrier strategies.

 

 

 

Stubyvast using oil and talc would be making a yuk barrier. Where the oily mess is just a bad nasty thing to the ant to be in contact with.

This barrier's functional mechanic is to be something they would want to avoid interaction with.

 

ANTdrew using alcohol and talc wold be making a, can't pass barrier. The alcohol makes a slurry of the talc, but then evaporates quickly, leaving behind a talc barrier that is just barely held in place by weak forces. The ants can cling to the talc but the talc cannot cling to itself or the side wall, it just falls off along with the ant trying to climb over it.

 

 

they are leveraging very different plans to keep the ants in.

one method hopes the ants won't make it over it, because it is too yuky. They maybe get stuck in it but can't get past it and may not want to keep touching it.

the other method hopes the ants can't get past it becasue it's not stable enough to offer reliable footing, falling off if it gets enough weight put on it.

 

 

i don't have the experience to say if one is any better. But i do understand the physics of the alcohol + talc plan, and why it works.

I believe the yuk barrier plan can work too, but might not be as noticeable when it is weakening possibly.

As the dry talc falls off, the places it is getting thin can just be visually seen.

As the oil and talc dries out/is easier to walk over, i'm not sure if it would also show signs as visually obvious in advance of no longer working.

That function is part of the way the barely held on talc just works,it falls off you can see where it is thinner,  so you can easily know if it needs some upkeep.

Edited by Full_Frontal_Yeti, June 21 2024 - 11:01 AM.

[ANTdrew]

Mixing oil and talc will make a sticky mess that ants could also walk across. Follow the tried and true methods described in many posts on here that you can search up in the archives.