7 replies to this topic

[Full_Frontal_Yeti]

I keep a colony of Pogonomyrmex Occidentalis. They change color a good deal over their life times, going form nearly white/golden yellowish at eclose to a deep dark red as late adults.

 

But some of them also devlope black internal coloring on their gastors. As if their guts become black and visible through them, though not all of them get this. What gives?

I fear something like parastic nematodes, though i have observed them like this from the begining(about 9 months ago). So i considered it something normal at first. But it is just such an oddity to me with no obvious patteren of what's happening. I want to know what's going on here.

 

Why this?

No black spot ant butts

 

Black spot ant butt

 

see the one in the group with it?

 

 

Is this normal, and what's causing it?

 

 

I can't say i've noticed any ominous patterens like black spot ants dying faster or anything like that. As far as i can notice who has it or not is arbitrary. But is something that devlopes over time, not something they are born showing.

 

Anyone got a clue what's gong on here?

[rptraut]

Constipated?

[Mirandarachnid]

It would be interesting to mark one of the ants with the black spot and see if it’s permanent or if it comes and goes.

[UtahAnts]

I don't believe it's a pathogen. I've noticed the worker mortality increase as well with harvester and honeypot workers with it. It doesn't seem to affect the whole colony and they often bounce back.

 

Perhaps they are deficient in something - protein diversification and constant access to water never hurts. It could also be a buildup of stored waste over the course of the worker's life. For instance cleaning and feeding the larvae and nest may result in consumed waste which the ants could store until death. A way for the colony to isolate contaminants in a non-natural environment.

[Full_Frontal_Yeti]

Thanks for the input yall.

 

 

Alwasy got plenty of fresh water out and generally some apple slice 4+ days of the week.

Protine is a rotation of a facny cat food pate' (basiaclly people food), fish flakes, freeze dried chicken hearts, and occasionally some feeder insect like cricket or waxworm. Always quickly boiled to try and prevent introcudtion of mites or whatever.

 

As far as i have noticed the black gastor ants are fairly few. Are not seen on younger ants but ones that have got the darker redness going. And don't seem to be affecting their helth/behavior that i can tell. Just some of them get this black marking inside their gastor while most do not. And that worried me a little as something i could not explain.

[BleepingBleepers]

If one such ant ever did die, would you try a dissection to see what it is?

 

I'd be curious.

 

Good time to get a microscope.

 

 

Perhaps reach out to someone that studies ants in scientific labs / classrooms, see what they know?

 

My guess is that certain workers like eating certain foods that show through their gaster more and/or that worker is a bit more dehydrated than the others. I'm thinking like people, some have different preferences, good or bad, when it comes to their diet or the way they keep themselves hydrated.

[Full_Frontal_Yeti]

Don't have a microscope.

 

I did however spot a fairly young ant (by color) that had a mostly black gaster and was starting to die.

Got to go over the macros I took.
But being a young ant I decided to call it a pathogen of some kind and started culling as the only thing i could think to do.

 

Just keeping the pooter at hand and watching for any that have the signs of it. It's not always the same i notice. Some get it in the tip and spreads inward, some get it at the top of the gaster and it spreads to the tip.  While most have no internal darkening of their gasters at all.

I think i've culled about 30-40 or so now and am not finding them as fast. But of course can't do anything about what's going on in the nest. Just cross my fingers and hope it's nothing serious / whatever it is don't get to the queen / what i'm doing makes a difference.

 

If i got any useful images I'll post some them tomorrow.

[Full_Frontal_Yeti]

here is the image of the dead younger worker from the last post.

 

 

The coloring on them is still a lighter redish orange, not yet going full red, indicating they are still fairly young.

The gaster is black but also white inside? That was a first, the others were only ever black inside that i saw.

And it is an internal coloring, not external.

It's a 25x macro, not as close or well lit as i'd have liked, but maybe someone here recognizes something about it?

 

As i said, being a younger ant made this a thing for me, that older ants had not yet. For all i knew that's just ant old age or something, but a blackened gaster younger worker dying is definitely not a normal thing.

 

 

Again, i've not noted any mass die offs, or that more dying ants were black gasters than not. But for me this was a sign that something bad was going on and i needed to do something.

 

Hopefully whatever this is, is only a stage rather than full life cycle. Maybe whatever it is will just die off eventually, if it can't do whatever it would do in nature to fulfill its life cycle. Rather than be something that goes full cycle in the ant colony alone until it's destroyed.

 

Probably should have held onto this one longer and done some kind of autopsy even though i don't have equipment for that really. But i was a bit freaked out and decided that culling the back gaster ants form the colony had to happen right now.
I'm keeping the pooter out and will be removing any i notice any blackening on at all.

 

The one good thing they got going for them is numbers, they seem quite healthy so I expect they should soak the culling without much notice.
 I'll keep this updated with any relevant details as time ticks on.
 

Edited by Full_Frontal_Yeti, January 29 2024 - 12:34 PM.