10 replies to this topic

[OhNoNotAgain]

Some of you may remember this story from my Novomessor journal. It's one of those types of stories that is probably not uncommon if you keep ants for a while, but I still found it ... bittersweet. I dug up some old photos and footage and put it together as a YouTube / Instagram video.

 

Edited by OhNoNotAgain, October 30 2023 - 9:23 AM.

[BleepingBleepers]

Wow, that sounds to be quite the journey but also kinda stressful to deal with. I have anxiety and stress issues. I get stuck on even minor details and problems in life and so reading all that, that sounds like a lot to deal with. Glad they're having a good 2023. You did everything you can and the ants look great.

 

Just to get it straight though, the old queen died, those workers just continue living, then you got a second queen and brood boosted the new queen with larva etc from the old colony, but the workers from the old colony you kept them separate from the new colony. And the new queen is now thriving as shown, right?

 

I guess that's why I only plan to keep one or two ant colonies, everything is nice and happy now, but if bad things start happening, the stress would be too much for me to deal with.

[OhNoNotAgain]

Wow, that sounds to be quite the journey but also kinda stressful to deal with. I have anxiety and stress issues. I get stuck on even minor details and problems in life and so reading all that, that sounds like a lot to deal with. Glad they're having a good 2023. You did everything you can and the ants look great.

 

Just to get it straight though, the old queen died, those workers just continue living, then you got a second queen and brood boosted the new queen with larva etc from the old colony, but the workers from the old colony you kept them separate from the new colony. And the new queen is now thriving as shown, right?

 

I guess that's why I only plan to keep one or two ant colonies, everything is nice and happy now, but if bad things start happening, the stress would be too much for me to deal with.

Right, I brood boosted the new queen - but the catch was it had been over 3 months and the original brood was almost all gone (though there was plenty of male brood from the queenless workers). ALSO the new queen might not have made it without that last worker, thanks to her nanitic tragically dying from going through the mail. So sort of like the candle flame was passed on from the first to the second colony through one last viable pupa.

 

Yeah I hear you on the stress aspects. Personally I'd keep at least two of the same species, one as backup so I don't feel totally bummed if one colony dies. For example, my long-running Pogonomyrmex colony just recently lost its queen for no apparent reason, but I still have one of the same species. I plan on letting them have the bigger digs of the ones who lost their queen... eventually.

Edited by OhNoNotAgain, October 30 2023 - 10:57 AM.

[OhNoNotAgain]

Also take losses as learning opportunities as much as possible. I lost a Liometopum queen once, possibly from egg-binding. Her gaster was overly full of eggs, but she wasn't laying ANYTHING at all and eventually died. (Liometopum queens are perfectly capable of laying lots of eggs without going physogastric.) Next time I had a Camponotus who looked like she MIGHT be going through the same thing, I actually pulled her out and um ... did some gaster massage through a plastic bag. I have no idea if it actually helped but she went on to lay eggs soon after and lost the overly-stuffed look.

Edited by OhNoNotAgain, October 30 2023 - 11:02 AM.

[100lols]

Dude the gaster massage through the bag blew my mind. Who is to say if it worked or not, but that’s one hell of a story!

[OhNoNotAgain]

Dude the gaster massage through the bag blew my mind. Who is to say if it worked or not, but that’s one hell of a story!

It’s def one of those wacky things only invert pet owners would get….

PS I may have done some of it directly not through the bag, but holding the queen by holding the bag was definitely key to the whole thing. So many things can go wrong though that I would not recommend it for anyone new to ants, for sure.

Edited by OhNoNotAgain, November 2 2023 - 3:37 PM.

[dspdrew]

You can sometimes boost with workers too if you have to, even mature ones. You just have to know there is a risk they can be killed or the the queen. I actually do it all the time without any deaths. The key is cooling them down so they are too lethargic to fight. They will almost always be getting along within about a day, and sometimes much less time than that. Sometimes when I add queens to colonies that lost their queen, they don't even fight at all, and just immediately get along and start cleaning each other. It's usually younger colonies that I do this with, so I'm not sure how much different the results would be with colonies that are much older.

[OhNoNotAgain]

Yeah I just didn't want to risk it with a solo brand new queen, esp. for a Novomessor where I'd never tried anything like that before. But that's good to know. However, I don't really have a good way of carefully cooling a colony without risking forgetting about them or getting too busy and leaving them in a fridge too long lol.

 

I know with M. mexicanus a lot depends on if the queen has had workers already and flipped some switch in her brain, and also whether she has living workers or not (the living will reject newcomers if I recall correctly). With certain large California Camponotus they may not care very much - a new worker just avoids the queen and her other workers if any for a half day. I've seen Preno colonies just move right into a larger existing colony - but likewise I've seen wild workers totally avoid an existing colony and die rather than move in. But Novomessor - hadn't tried it.

 

ETA: I remember with Veromessor I once put workers back into a colony they had come from weeks before. They got massacred....

Edited by OhNoNotAgain, November 2 2023 - 6:24 PM.

[dspdrew]

ETA: I remember with Veromessor I once put workers back into a colony they had come from weeks before. They got massacred....

 

Oh yeah, if you keep some workers away from their colony for too long, they seem to no longer recognize each other and will fight. When I'm out collecting, and have a colony split up in any way, I always worry about that. I've seen it happen in a fairly short amount of time before.

[100lols]

I wonder if being disturbed/being in a panic can provoke or increase such behavior when reintroducing? Or maybe colony scent changes/fades faster some times. Interesting stuff.

[ANTdrew]

Yeah I just didn't want to risk it with a solo brand new queen, esp. for a Novomessor where I'd never tried anything like that before. But that's good to know. However, I don't really have a good way of carefully cooling a colony without risking forgetting about them or getting too busy and leaving them in a fridge too long lol.

I know with M. mexicanus a lot depends on if the queen has had workers already and flipped some switch in her brain, and also whether she has living workers or not (the living will reject newcomers if I recall correctly). With certain large California Camponotus they may not care very much - a new worker just avoids the queen and her other workers if any for a half day. I've seen Preno colonies just move right into a larger existing colony - but likewise I've seen wild workers totally avoid an existing colony and die rather than move in. But Novomessor - hadn't tried it.

ETA: I remember with Veromessor I once put workers back into a colony they had come from weeks before. They got massacred....

You could set a timer just like if you were cooking something?