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Are these good guidelines for feeding Messors after the 1st nanitic is out?


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#1 Offline Formiga - Posted May 14 2023 - 3:51 PM

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Hey guys!

It is with great pleasure that I announce you that finally yesterday I saw my 1st Messor nanitic walking around after all these months since September!

 

Thanks everyone for helping me keeping my patience and hope since last year my Formica fusca 2 colonies were raided by outside ants and totally devastated.

There's also another queen with 2 already black pupa, so in a few days I hope they come out.

I'm back in business boys!

 

Since this forum does not have a caring guide for Messors and I'm still too noobie doobie doo to write one (maybe in a couple years?), I looked around previously for information and gathered some notes from a comment from a YouTube video.

I didn't write down the commenter's name, so I don't know who to credit.

 

So I'm posting you down below the comment I've gathered.

Do you guys think these are good trustworthy guidelines? If nay, please correct them.

 

Many thanks guys!

 

 

when and what to feed the 1st Messor naniticks?

Only give a small amount of seeds when a claustral colony has its first workers or is very close to it with darkened pupae. They workers keep the seeds away from the water cotton just fine, unless you give too much of them. It's wise at this point to attach a small feeding outworld box to the test tube because of all the garbage Messor produces and they can put seeds there if they find the tube too wet or cramped.

People can keep claustral Messor colonies without the need to keep them covered and unchecked. Simply put them in a place with not too bright light with ZERO vibrations (put them on something dampening on a bookshelf or something). No need for even a silly red cover and you can look at them all you want without actually disturbing them. Leaving claustral queens unchecked for long periods is never a good idea (and you do need to give them within about a week when the first workers arive), but the vibrations of uncovering a colony often induces more panic than simply the sudden influx of light.

Seriously, don't give sugar water to Messors. They'll only drink it if they desperately need the moisture. But with all the seed garbage everywhere, even sterile sugar water will generally be quickly found by yeast bacteria and start fermenting with all the problems that come with that.

You start feeding her from the moment she has her first workers, you can place them in a tubs and tubes set up or connect the test tube to a foraging area, i am moving my colony into a small nest early, its advised to wait until they have 30-50 workers before moving them into a small founding nest.

Messors are not a hunting species more a scavenging species, i find its not until they are in the hundreds of workers that live prey like a mario worm will not stress them out, the larger workers are not good at hunting fruit flies, it really varies between species and how adapt they are as hunters, with messors primary food source being seeds they do not necessarily get any benefits from hunting live foods.

they don't actually need insects, they get all their proteins from seeds, no need to stress too much over feeding them insects, as long as they have a good mix of seeds and access to fresh water.

 



#2 Offline Ernteameise - Posted May 14 2023 - 11:13 PM

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I only just started with Messor and I have a small rescue colony.
The observations I made:
They stress out easily. I actually find it helpful to cover the tube, and the best and least stressful way for me is a piece of toilet paper roll to cover the test tube. And yes, vibrations freak them out.
As for feeding- I feed them very small seed and seed that are ground up, since they cannot handle big seed by themselves yet.
I also offer them protein and they take it greedily. Ham, chicken, egg ( all tiny tiny pieces!) are taken into the tube. I do not think that can hurt offering it.

#3 Offline AntaholicAnonymous - Posted May 15 2023 - 7:56 AM

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For a small colony I'd highly recommend chia seeds.
They are high in protein and very convenient for all sizes of workers to transport and process.
I have messor barbarus for 3 years and 80 percent of their diet are chia seeds they love them.

#4 Offline Formiga - Posted May 15 2023 - 12:16 PM

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@Ernteameise and @AntaholicAnonymous, thank you for your replies.

 

 

the best and least stressful way for me is a piece of toilet paper roll to cover the test tube.


I also offer them protein and they take it greedily. Ham, chicken, egg ( all tiny tiny pieces!) are taken into the tube. I do not think that can hurt offering it.


Cutting the toilet paper roll tube longitudinally in half seems to be a good idea.

 

I just left them inside a little long case like the ones used to store glasses, but longer and made out of transparent plastic.

They are on top of a shelf away from direct sun light and do not seem to be bothered at all by light. The place is well lit and when I turn all the lights on they do not react.

So I can leave them in the clear for observation. It's marvelous to see mom and daughter sleeping around and taking care of the eggs.

 

The case edges are surrounded with talc powder that I mixed with alcohol so they won't escape.

Inside the case I also have a fresh test tube with water because at the time I didn't have any so I had to improvise with syringes and all the queens I still have inside syringes are almost running dry out of water.

So they have the syringe end open if and when they want to go outside, some seeds just inside the opening, and a new test tube for if and when they decide to explore outside and that can be a better new home than the one they're actually in, at their own pace.

 

I find this case to be a very good solution. Not perfect visually as the plastic is not totally transparent but good enough for a simple observation, and it damps vibrations very well. I've gently tapped the wooden top of the shelf next to their case and even the case itself, and they did not react.

 

This way I can leave them unattended but easily observable and with no stress for them for the next few weeks. Short term they have everything taken care of.

 

 

 

For a small colony I'd highly recommend chia seeds.
They are high in protein and very convenient for all sizes of workers to transport and process.
I have messor barbarus for 3 years and 80 percent of their diet are chia seeds they love them.


Luckily I have some human grade seeds here for my salads so I can test them.

I crushed some chia, some other white seeds I don't have the name of, and some brown linseeds. I placed them inside the syringe's tube and curiously it was the queen, not the nanitic, who came to check on them and immediately grabbed some crushed brown linseeds and took them in. Since the setup is not perfectly cristal clear I couldn't see if she placed them on top of the eggs, the larva or just some place near them.

 

 

A few  questions about crushed seeds:

- Do they feed them directly to the larva like with dead insects directly placed on top of them for nom nom nomming? Or do they make ant bread first and them feed them with it?

 

- Also, I know uncrushed seeds can be stored for a long time because they store their moist shelled inside, but once crushed, can they be stored also for some good time or will they go bad soon? (I'm assuming they will take the trash out or at least out of the way.)

 

- I have some dried ground linseed. Would this be OK for them or not, since it is dried and they should be fed only fresh seeds?

 

 

Cheers and thanks.


Edited by Formiga, May 15 2023 - 12:21 PM.

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#5 Offline Ernteameise - Posted May 15 2023 - 10:21 PM

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Ground seed do not keep fresh very long.
What I actually do, I take a pinch of seed, place them into large spoon, then take a small spoon, grind, and feed fresh every time.
If you have more starter colonies, using a grinder for herbs or pepper can also be used to grind fresh every time.
As far as I know, the larvae do not eat seed directly, the workers have to make bread first and chew it for them.
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#6 Offline Formiga - Posted May 16 2023 - 10:10 AM

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Thanks for the hints, @Ernteameise.

 

I had already figured out you could crush seeds with spoons. First I tried two large butter knifes, it worked but it was not practical. Then I tried two coffee spoons and it's kind of meh. Sure, a big one and a small one should do the job better, I'll try it next time. Sure your wheel is rounder than mine! :yes:

 

Any hints on feeding them while on the test tube?

I find it way too stressful for them...

The picking up and moving around of the test tube, the pliers or the little spoon entering the tube... I tried it on my other queen that already had 2 black pupa and she freaked out and attacked the pliers, clinging onto them and then I had to wait a bit because you can't shake and yeet the queen out. It's stressful both for them and for me, and that can lead them to eat their eggs again.

 

So from those who have more experience, how do you do it?



#7 Offline Formiga - Posted May 16 2023 - 10:49 AM

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Any hints on feeding them while on the test tube?

 

 

Well, I've just asked YouTube and here are a couple of very good suggestions:

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=yVHXubkH-E0

 

In this video he uses a cut out plastic pipette inserted into the test tube. It may cause some stress but if well done that can be minimized. The highlight of this technique is that it is very clean.

And I happen to have a lot of these pipettes sitting around... So, problem solved! :yahoo:

 

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=AiCDVdLpLVg

 

Here in this video he shows a technique of using a fluffy towel as a base for placing the test tubes while feeding. It minimizes stressful vibrations, avoids rolling of the test tube, and is a very good way to avoid ants from escaping far and making it easy to collect them unharmed. Very interesting and practical indeed!

 

Probably the most experienced of you already knew these techniques, but I'm leaving them here for new ant keepers to find and save them some stress and research work.

 

 

Cheers.


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#8 Offline Ernteameise - Posted May 16 2023 - 12:37 PM

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I just wanted to suggest something like that, but you found out yourself.
This should work.
My founder colony ( queen and 10 workers) has an open test tube, I feed the seeds directly in front and they use sand to partially close the entrance. See my thread about the „ rescue ants“.
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