10 replies to this topic

[Rob912]

Hi all!

 

Recently I saw some ants in a test-tube at a friend place. I looked at it and thought; wow! I want a colony.

So here I am looking into all that the internet and this forum has to offer prioir to raising my own colony. I am thinking about starting with Messor Barbarus. But first I want to expand my knowledge and learn about taking care of ants.

Awesome hobby, right!

 

And like the title says; I'm from the Netherlands.

Have a great day!

[ANTdrew]

Welcome! You can learn a lot of great things on here. Good luck!

[Serafine]

Messor barbarus is a good choice as they're easy to care for (since they eat seeds and their protein needs can be covered with boiled eggs) and cheap in terms of food. They're also VERY active and large enough to be easy to observe.

 

HOWEVER there are a few things you should know before starting with this species.

 

- Get a small colony. Not a queen, a small colony. Single queens tend to be super susceptible to disturbance and you'll basically have an ant you can't even look at for 4+ weeks.

 

- Messor barbarus colonies can become MASSIVE. Not the "above 5000 ants" massive that some shops misleadingly say, more like 50.000 ants massive (that's A LOT more ants than it sounds). If you have the space, that makes them super cool. If you just want a small colony in the corner of the room, get something like Formica fusca or Camponotus japonicus instead.

 

- Messor barbarus, once grown beyond a few hundred workers, will absolutely DEMOLISH their outworlds. They will carve out the substrate, build lots of small anthills, cut artificial plants to pieces, untroot or bury plants, place seeds and water them so they may grow into little gardens, etc. and generally leave no stone unturned. They're the McGyvers of the ant world, all you can do is give them materials to play with and watch them going bananas with them. The upside is they will pretty much always be busy with building or reshaping something.

 

- If you use transparent tubing avoid 180° turns. Messor barabarus workers tend to navigate by using light sources and a u-turn might confuse them (i've seen that happen to someone in a journal). If you can't avoid a 180° turn just cover either the part before or after the corner to block out the light (that's what fixed the problem for the guy who had workers running back and forth before dropping their seeds at the turning point).

 

- Oh, and their poo is very oily and they love to crap all over the nest inside walls if the nest is permanently exposed to light. If you give them a small extra outworld they may use it as a toilet and spare the other parts of the setup.

 

 

Well, if you're cool with all that, have fun, they're absolutely great ants (Messor barbarus most likely the most popular pet ant species in Europe for good reasons).

Edited by Serafine, August 29 2022 - 2:54 PM.

[BioScorpion]

Welcome to formiculture Rob. 

[Rob912]

Thank you so much for your detailed explanation Serafine! This is not what I have been told in (web)stores. So this is very helpful!

 

This makes me think if I should start with Messor Barbarus as my first colony. Expecially since you have replied at my other topic as wel about the sanded bridges for decoration versus the demolishing character of the Messor Barbarus.

Does that apply to all Messors? Like the Messor Structor for example?

 

I don't know if this is the right place to go on but now I'm wondering what species to start with?

 

I would like:

- The ants to be a bit bigger

- The ants to be active

- The ants to stand a little light

- The ants not to grow to big to fast

- Make a beautiful outworld and nest that will not be demolished 

 

So maybe Camponotus japonicus?

Edited by Rob912, August 30 2022 - 2:45 AM.

[Serafine]

The "sticking gabarge into holes" is a general ant problem - if you look up my Camponotus journal there's an artifical stone platform in one of the large outworlds and they just love to stick trash under it. At one point they filled up the whole space.

 

From what i've read all Messor seem to share the destructive nature, the bigger ones (like barbarus) are just better at it. They also all grow into massive colonies over time (the bigger ones tend to grow a bit slower) and it's difficult to control their growth as their main food (seeds) contains both carbohydrates and protein (and i'm not a fan of starving ants as this usually exacerbates other issues like ants trying to break out).

 

Camponotus japonicus is large but like all Camponotus they grow slow and are kinda inactive at the start (and "the start" is like the first year for them). They do stay small though (very small actually) and thus also don't need that much food and won't produce too much garbage.

 

Formica fusca (or similar species Formica lemani) might be an option. They're kinda middle ground size-wise (4-8mm, first workers will be small but after a year or two you get much bigger ones), VERY active, active during the day and grow fast but don't grow too big (usually they top out at 2-3000, although I've seen one that did particularly well at probably 8000 workers - that's still very manageable though).

They do not like vibrations, so they can't be placed like on your work desk but otherwise they're about as resilient and adaptable as Lasius niger. And while they will explore their setup a lot and quickly drag food back to their nest just like Lasius niger they are NOT as aggressive as those. Formica fusca will not try to eat every ant colony within reach if they break out, they usually avoid conflict so they are no threat if you plan to keep other ants down the line. Also they are highly polygynous, meaning they can have multiple queens.

Edited by Serafine, August 30 2022 - 5:11 AM.

[Rob912]

Thanks again for your detailed answer. I have been reading your journal, impressive and it gives a good view of keeping the Camponotus.

 

 

I'm going to delve into Formica fusca to see if that's a good ant for me. It is a native ant in the Netherlands. That's a big advantage. Unfortunately missed the nuptial flights I think..

[Serafine]

Thanks again for your detailed answer. I have been reading your journal, impressive and it gives a good view of keeping the Camponotus.

Those are mediterranean Camponotus though, their growth is not representative of northern Camponotus (herculeanus, ligniperda, etc.), those grow much slower.
There's also fast-growing tropical Camponotus but i'd be careful with those (i've talked with someone who had Camponotus brasiliensis and he had to give them away after 2 years, he wasn't able to even open the lid without getting burning eyes as they sprayed stupid amounts of formic acid at every disturbance - probably not the case with most tropical Camponotus but still, those things can happen).
 
 

I'm going to delve into Formica fusca to see if that's a good ant for me. It is a native ant in the Netherlands. That's a big advantage. Unfortunately missed the nuptial flights I think..

They're really great ants. I was trying to find one this year but it didn't happen so we went for Lasius niger (which isn't exactly easy to keep in the long run but i think we can handle it).

[Rob912]

The more I read the more I come to the conclusion to start (almost) as easy as possible.

 

I saw online that Formica Fusca is available nearby.
Serafine do you recommend 1 queen with some workers or 2 queens with some workers? I want to start with a testtube setup.

 

Ah I see you live in Germany so we share some common native ants then. Nice! I was told that the Lasius Niger is supposed to be the most easy ant to keep. No?

[AntsCali098]

I believe L.niger is a great way to start. Easy ant to keep. The only thing is they are relatively small, I believe a bit less than fusca.

[Serafine]

Lasius niger is NOT an ideal starter ant. Yes, they are rubost and able to thrive in less than ideal conditions BUT they are notorious escape artists, can grow to 50.000+ workers and absolutely hate every other ant on the planet - the first thing they'll do when they manage to escape is to go on a genocidal murder spree and kill all other ant colonies around them.

They're a constant death threat to all other colonies in your room (actually even in your house) and keeping them contained after year 3-4 is as much of a challenge as keeping Solenopsis fire ants contained, arguable from what i've heard and read about the lenghts they're willing to go to exterminate their competition once they know about it they're WORSE than fire ants, at least in the escape artist and genocidal murder spree departments - the main difference there seems to be that Lasius niger remembers while fire ants don't really seem to do.

Edited by Serafine, September 3 2022 - 4:57 AM.