43 replies to this topic

[Max_Connor]

I've heard some antkeepers talking on the internet about the consequences of keeping exotic species, the ones that are not native to your area.

That it's important to buy and catch only those ants that are native to where you live, and that keeping any exotic species (not even necessarily invasive) is not ethical for some environmental reasons which I don't understand...

 

What's so bad about keeping say southern species in the Northern Hemisphere?

If you let the alates escape your nest and let them fly and breed in your area (where there aren't any other alates of the same species), nothing happens.

 

Even if you have a polygynous species that can escape and successfully live outside, one winter will kill them all as soon as they're from South and do not hibernate.

 

Suppose they have parasites that are not native to your area too - those will be some worms and mites, but if you succeed in killing them or just don't let them out of the nest then nothing really threatens your environment again.

 

I just don't get the reasoning behind all this so-called bioethics...

 

What do you think of this whole argument? And do you keep any invasive ants? 

 

 

 

 

[BrandonM]

I wonder if the folks that introduced the species below into their new environments felt the same as you…

Cane Toad

Burmese Python

Northern Snakehead Fish

Asian Carp

European Starling

Mongoose

Feral swine

Domestic cats

Nutria (from S. America)

Gypsy Moth

Here’s a link to other benign species that have been introduced with minimal impact to just N. America.

https://en.m.wikiped...n_North_America


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[TennesseeAnts]

I think the concern is pretty overblown. Responsible keepers that know what they're doing aren't an issue. About the ethics, a few people do believe keeping any exotic is bad- invasive or not. I am not one of those. Again, if you are responsible and know what you're doing there's really no risk at all to the environment around you. Like you pointed out, most ants need alates of an unrelated colony to actually mate and found colonies. Unless there's already a colony established of said species around you, escaped alates also aren't an issue.

[zA-Z0-9]

i totally get why they do this because not everyones  responsible enough to keep thier pets in thier enclosures as proven with the burmese python but i personally keep exotic ants because i feel responsibe enough to take this responsibility

[ANTdrew]

Here we go again…

[Kaelwizard]

Here we go again…

Yep…

[TennesseeAnts]

Here we go again…

I know, it feels like every week a new one pops up..

[Tyr_Ants]

Quick solution, ban all ants 😎😎 problem solved lol

Edited by Tyr_Ants, August 7 2021 - 5:20 PM.

[Max_Connor]

I wonder if the folks that introduced the species below into their new environments felt the same as you…

Cane Toad

Burmese Python

Northern Snakehead Fish

Asian Carp

European Starling

Mongoose

Feral swine

Domestic cats

Nutria (from S. America)

Gypsy Moth

Here’s a link to other benign species that have been introduced with minimal impact to just N. America.

https://en.m.wikiped...n_North_America


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

 

Well ok, I get that there are a lot of examples of invasive species that have been introduced by pet owners to different habitats.

 

But take the Burmese pythons - they have invaded Florida, where they have no natural predators (except humans) and where they eliminated lots of birds, foxes, rabbits etc.

But why should we be concerned about it so much? Unless the pythons start threatening humans - those are agricultural issues, for example - we shouldn't care, maybe?

 

Can a bunch of pythons make the whole ecosystem collapse? Will whole cities be impacted by elimination of rabbits and birds?

 

And how can some ants from Southeast Asia survive in northern states, for example?

[NickAnter]

Some of the burmese python issue isn't strictly the fault of keepers. MANY escaped when buildings that were holding many of them were destroyed from hurricanes. The only times species from Southeast Asia end up in Northern areas are in places like greenhouses, or indoors. They don't really survive in the wild. A minor exception to this is Brachyponera chinensis, which has been found wild all the way up in Massachusetts. They are quite cold hardy it would appear, however, they are a species with a vast range in Southeast Asia, and much of their distribution is above it.

[zA-Z0-9]

 

I wonder if the folks that introduced the species below into their new environments felt the same as you…

Cane Toad

Burmese Python

Northern Snakehead Fish

Asian Carp

European Starling

Mongoose

Feral swine

Domestic cats

Nutria (from S. America)

Gypsy Moth

Here’s a link to other benign species that have been introduced with minimal impact to just N. America.

https://en.m.wikiped...n_North_America


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

 

Well ok, I get that there are a lot of examples of invasive species that have been introduced by pet owners to different habitats.

 

But take the Burmese pythons - they have invaded Florida, where they have no natural predators (except humans) and where they eliminated lots of birds, foxes, rabbits etc.

But why should we be concerned about it so much? Unless the pythons start threatening humans - those are agricultural issues, for example - we shouldn't care, maybe?

 

Can a bunch of pythons make the whole ecosystem collapse? Will whole cities be impacted by elimination of rabbits and birds?

 

And how can some ants from Southeast Asia survive in northern states, for example?

 

ok no offense man and I'm not tryna be mean or nothin but i was on your side at first but youre starting to sound a little crazy i mean lets not pretend the ecoystem isn't delicate dude like come on 

[zA-Z0-9]

Quick solution, ban all ants problem solved lol

that's not even funny my queen ant almost threw up her breakfast when she read this take it down or i will have it reported immediately lolol

Edited by zA-Z0-9, August 7 2021 - 9:06 PM.

[Tyr_Ants]

Quick solution, ban all ants problem solved lol

that's not even funny my queen ant almost threw up her breakfast when she read this take it down or i will have it reported immediately lolol

NOOOOOO please don't I beg u please don't report me

[Max_Connor]

 

 

ok no offense man and I'm not tryna be mean or nothin but i was on your side at first but youre starting to sound a little crazy i mean lets not pretend the ecoystem isn't delicate dude like come on 

 

 

 Has there ever been a case when the whole system was destroyed because of a couple of imported species? And have the people died out in that area? 

[zA-Z0-9]

 

 

 

ok no offense man and I'm not tryna be mean or nothin but i was on your side at first but youre starting to sound a little crazy i mean lets not pretend the ecoystem isn't delicate dude like come on 

 

 

 Has there ever been a case when the whole system was destroyed because of a couple of imported species? And have the people died out in that area? 

 

have you ever been to australia  invasive species result in crop failure they compete with your livestock etc. for example if i was a beekeper and you released your colony of army ants and a few other people had the same idea they would kill my bees leaving me and every other beekeper out of a job not to mention the native ants they would destroy i still keep exotic ants but I'm not gonna pretend its not wrong so i guess my answer is people don't die out because of an invasive species but life gets alot harder for everyone 

Edited by zA-Z0-9, August 7 2021 - 11:25 PM.

[zA-Z0-9]

 

 

Quick solution, ban all ants problem solved lol

that's not even funny my queen ant almost threw up her breakfast when she read this take it down or i will have it reported immediately lolol

NOOOOOO please don't I beg u please don't report me

 

lol  don't tempt her she just might now out of her majestys sight  :mad2:its people like you that make her sick to her gaster

Edited by zA-Z0-9, August 7 2021 - 11:09 PM.

[Max_Connor]

 

 

 

 

ok no offense man and I'm not tryna be mean or nothin but i was on your side at first but youre starting to sound a little crazy i mean lets not pretend the ecoystem isn't delicate dude like come on 

 

 

 Has there ever been a case when the whole system was destroyed because of a couple of imported species? And have the people died out in that area? 

 

have you ever been to australia  invasive species result in crop failure they compete with your livestock etc. for example if i was a beekeper and you released your colony of army ants and a few other people had the same idea they would kill my bees leaving me and every other beekeper out of a job not to mention the native ants they would destroy i still keep exotic ants but I'm not gonna pretend its not wrong so i guess my answer is people don't die out because of an invasive species but life gets alot harder for everyone 

 

 

 

Hmmm.... Releasing army ants in Australia - sounds tempting

[DDD101DDD]

 

 

 

ok no offense man and I'm not tryna be mean or nothin but i was on your side at first but youre starting to sound a little crazy i mean lets not pretend the ecoystem isn't delicate dude like come on 

 

 

 Has there ever been a case when the whole system was destroyed because of a couple of imported species? And have the people died out in that area? 

 

 

In that case, let's just burn everything that we don't absolutely need for no reason because humans are definitely the only thing that's important and we're the only ones with a right to live on this earth.

Edited by DDD101DDD, August 8 2021 - 5:49 AM.

[futurebird]

Beyond harming human food sources like crops don't you like having thousands of different kinds of ants to learn about from all over the world? Invasive species can drive more rare ants to extinction. There might even be ants that we have not even studied that we never get to know. I think that is tragic. 

 

I do think that ant laws in the US are a bit of a mess. But I hope you can understand that unique and beautiful creatures are worth protecting. If not because it's nice to care about living things then because they enrich our understanding of the world when we study them. 

 

It'd be horrible if every climate that was the same had the exact same species all over the world. 

 

I do think that it should be possible to keep exotic ants, from perhaps an approved list of those unlikely to spread. And after reading this thread I'm thinking we need to educate keepers more. Please don't release alates that aren't native. Come on dude. 

[GreekAnts]

Probably troll topic...
you clearly want to start a debate and make people get upset, I can clear see it from your answers..


If you want to keep exotic ants just be really careful and make sure you are legal, because you will end up in trouble.
Have some common sense, be extra careful with them and don't be irresponsible letting them out or letting them escape,if they manage to get out you will be responsible for ruining the local or even national ecosystem...
Do not expect people to cheer you up for keeping exotic ants, by keeping them you will have to face the anxiety and fear of them ending up outside with all the results this might bring.
For me only people with special permit and skill should keep exotic ants, and if someone that has exotic ants is responsible for their escape and the damage that they caused, he/she must pay a big fine or even face jail time.