25 replies to this topic

[ANTdrew]

I have two Crematogaster colonies living in BoxBox containers from the Container Store. The lids fit snugly, but I put a band of byFormica around the rim and on the lid, so I can access the ants without them escaping. The issue is that they just walk right over the fluon! I followed the application instructions carefully, so I’m wondering why it’s not working? At the rate their growing, this will be a problem soon!

[Acutus]

Just curious, How wide a band did you put? Did you only go over the area 1 time? I haven't tried this yet on the Crematogaster  but it works great on Camponotus,

[Somethinghmm]

Fluon doesn't work so well in a humid environment. You should take off the lid or use a mesh to increase ventilation

[FeedTheAnts]

Crematogaster have excellent grips, which you'll find out if you ever try to blow them off of wood or really any other surfaces. I've never used fluon, but I know that in order to contain Crematogaster colonies(especially once they are large) you need a wide barrier. It could also be the surface that you put the barrier on. Was it glass, slick plastic, or rougher plastic with a matte feel? Sometimes rougher plastic doesn't allow the barrier to work as well(in my experience with talcom powder). You may need to put the barrier on top of packaging tape or something like that.

[ANTdrew]

The box is a smooth acrylic, and I have two mesh covered holes in the lid. I have two test tubes in there and liquid feeders, so maybe humidity is the problem? How do people deal with this in THA formicariums with lids for example?
Crematogasters’ grip is unreal, for sure!

Edited by ANTdrew, May 25 2019 - 2:07 PM.

[drtrmiller]

I think the issue, as you mentioned, is that the "lids fit snugly."  You're likely getting high humidity in the container, as a result.  As the instructions note, Fluon works best with open-top or well-ventilated setups.  If you take a photo, I can tell you if the application looks good.

 

If you have a test tube, you can test the Fluon by coating the outside of a test tube (the closed end) and sticking it in the setup to see if ants can climb on it.  Once the coating has dried, they shouldn't be able to climb on the areas of the glass that have been coated with Fluon.

 

When Fluon fails due to humidity, the visual appearance doesn't change.  So when troubleshooting, you need to start with a diagnostic test to make sure your product and application method is sufficient to prevent ants from climbing on the treated surface.  Once you verify this, you can move on to modifying your setup, such as leaving the lid off, if necessary, to prevent the humidity buildup.

Edited by drtrmiller, May 30 2019 - 2:56 PM.

[ANTdrew]

Ok, I will get some photos tonight. I'm really eager to solve this issue. I even saw one walking on the upside down part of the fluon coated lid last night.

Edited by ANTdrew, May 30 2019 - 10:27 AM.

[ANTdrew]

Drtmiller,

Here is a picture of their BoxBox setup. There are two 1/4 ventilation holes on the lid, and two holes on the sides stuffed with cotton.

 

How do you suggest improving this?

[Zeiss]

 

Drtmiller,

Here is a picture of their BoxBox setup. There are two 1/4 ventilation holes on the lid, and two holes on the sides stuffed with cotton.

 

 

How do you suggest improving this?

 

Those ventilation holes are nowhere near big enough to keep humidity down in that size container.  The holes need to be larger.

[ANTdrew]

Got it! I'll work on new and improved lids this weekend.

[drtrmiller]

Actually, I've had trouble with certain types of plastic before not working as well with Fluon.  This box may be one of those.

 

The box should have a recycling code on the bottom.  It will probably either be #6 or #7.  I've had problems with some #7 plastics, which can include some specialty resin materials.

 

Also, when you applied the Fluon, did you roll it several times to distribute the contents, and then did you use the marker bottle?  The marker bottle would work best in containers with rounded corners like that.

[ANTdrew]

Yes, I did roll the bottles. I will check the plastic code as well. Thank you for the input, everyone!

[ANTdrew]

I checked the box, and they are #6 plastic.

[drtrmiller]

I checked the box, and they are #6 plastic.

 

In that case, just thoroughly clean the existing Fluon off with a damp, lint free cloth, dry the surface, reapply, and don't put the lid on.  Once dry, see if the ants can cross the barrier.  To prevent humidity buildup, do not put the lid on at any time.  Let us know how that works.

Edited by drtrmiller, May 31 2019 - 1:33 PM.

[ANTdrew]

I checked the box, and they are #6 plastic.

In that case, just thoroughly clean the existing Fluon off with a damp, lint free cloth, dry the surface, reapply, and don't put the lid on. Once dry, see if the ants can cross the barrier. To prevent humidity buildup, do not put the lid on at any time. Let us know how that works.

I renewed the fluon and removed the lid, and the problem seems to be solved! Humidity is at 45% in the room they are kept in. How counterintuitive!

[ANTdrew]

Nope. Still escaping. ARGHHHHHGGH!!!!!

[Zeiss]

Nope. Still escaping. ARGHHHHHGGH!!!!!

You may not have put enough layers of it before letting them crawl on it.  I usually use 3 layers and let it dry overnight.

[ANTdrew]

One coat on top of the other you mean? The package instructions say to only do one pass.
Nothing saps my enthusiasm for this hobby like escapees.

Edited by ANTdrew, June 1 2019 - 3:00 PM.

[drtrmiller]

You can't brush wet product onto a dried coat or the dried coating will peel off into clumps and render the new coat useless.  I really don't know what to tell you at this point.  Have you tried with any other ants?  Maybe this species is just incompatible?

[FeedTheAnts]

I would switch to talcom powder. I can't say I've  never had issues with Crematogaster and talcom powder barriers, but it definitely works better than your fluon.

Edited by FeedTheAnts, June 1 2019 - 3:18 PM.