18 replies to this topic

[TennesseeAnts]

I am hibernating one C. chromaides colony for the preferred three months, and one for two. I am going to record the experiment here as it goes on. It is to see if hibernation for two months is sufficient for good colony growth next year. I will be adding the second colony in January when their three months is up.

(Sorry if this doesn't make sense, I am terrible at explaining things!)

Edited by Ant_Dude2908, December 2 2018 - 10:44 AM.

[Kalidas]

It made sense to me. Can C. chromaides still have a good year with only two months of hibernating as upposed to the normal 3 months that is recommended. Good luck can't wait to see the results. What's your hypothesis?

[TennesseeAnts]

I don't think there will be a huge difference in development, but we will have to wait and see!

[sirjordanncurtis]

Are they at the same sizes?

[CampoKing]

Wish I could find the post, either on here or AntsCanada, somebody tested a crap ton of colonies from one month to seven months and seemed convinced that 4 months is a sweet spot for most. I'm personally doing 4 months for my C. pennsylvanicus colonies.

[TennesseeAnts]

They both have the same amount of workers.

[ConcordAntman]

Wish I could find the post, either on here or AntsCanada, somebody tested a crap ton of colonies from one month to seven months and seemed convinced that 4 months is a sweet spot for most. I'm personally doing 4 months for my C. pennsylvanicus colonies.

I think this might have been the thread you were talking about http://www.formicult...to-hibernation/
Look at #12 (Crystals’ post).

[TennesseeAnts]

Well the one with 2 months has a pupa and a bunch of larvae. Then one with 3 months is close behind at the larvae stage.

[Mdrogun]

Wish I could find the post, either on here or AntsCanada, somebody tested a crap ton of colonies from one month to seven months and seemed convinced that 4 months is a sweet spot for most. I'm personally doing 4 months for my C. pennsylvanicus colonies.

It is going to vary heavily depending on the genus, species, and where the ants are found. Obviously ants in Tennessee don't have the same hibernation requirements as ants in Ottawa. Camponotus are also special because they don't rely entirely on temperature for hibernation. They can, and will, still hibernate at room temperature.

[CampoKing]

Wish I could find the post, either on here or AntsCanada, somebody tested a crap ton of colonies from one month to seven months and seemed convinced that 4 months is a sweet spot for most. I'm personally doing 4 months for my C. pennsylvanicus colonies.

 

Funny thing, I just found this article about diapause in carpenter ants *after* I have nearly finish hibernating my colonies: https://doi.org/10.1....1992.tb01188.x

Turns out that black carpenter ants, which is what I keep, are perfectly capable of hibernating well near freezing and below   In fact, my strategy of hibernating them at a mild 46F may have been harmful, as it could have been simply too warm for a species like this.

Live and learn!

[YsTheAnt]

Just because they can survive, does not mean it is reccomended. 46F is perfectly fine for hibernation and I have yet to see any experienced antkeeper reccomended lower temperatures.

[CampoKing]

Just because they can survive, does not mean it is reccomended. 46F is perfectly fine for hibernation and I have yet to see any experienced antkeeper reccomended lower temperatures.

 

Well I'm also curious if these other antkeepers are dealing with C. pennsylvanicus.  My experience so far is that my pennsylvanicus colonies are still somewhat active and responsive at 46F.  I feel like that should not be the case.

[TennesseeAnts]

Oh, forgot about this. Both colonies have around the same amount of workers and brood. 

[Joehostile85]

I am hibernating one C. chromaides colony for the preferred three months, and one for two. I am going to record the experiment here as it goes on. It is to see if hibernation for two months is sufficient for good colony growth next year. I will be adding the second colony in January when their three months is up.
(Sorry if this doesn't make sense, I am terrible at explaining things!)

I appreciate your experiment. However it could be considered 2 and 3 months is not a huge difference. What would be more telling is a difference of between say a queen hibernated for 5 months vs a queen hibernated for 2 months vs a queen not hibernated at all and then compare the worker count after a full year of growth. Of course to make that Scientific you would have to have several queens in each category.

But hibernation length is not about worker counts. What is more important than a colony having a few hundred more workers than a colony that hasn’t had proper hibernation periods is the longevity of the colony. It stands to reason that for every month a queen is not hibernated it takes a month off the end of her life.

If a Lasius queen can live for 30 years, but naturally hibernates for 5 months out of the year that means she spends 150 months(12.5 years) not active. It would be reasonable to conclude that if she was never hibernated she could lose 12.5 years of potential life expectancy.

Edited by Joehostile85, March 18 2019 - 7:11 AM.

[TennesseeAnts]

Yeah, I know that. However, it is a pretty big difference for Camponotus, as they need three to five months of hibernation. I find there is actually little to no difference between a colony with three months of hibernation, and a colony with five.

Edited by Ant_Dude2908, March 18 2019 - 7:48 AM.

[Joehostile85]

Yeah, I know that. However, it is a pretty big difference for Camponotus, as they need three to five months of hibernation. I find there is actually little to no difference between a colony with three months of hibernation, and a colony with five.

The Lasius neoniger queens also hibernate for 5 months as that is how long winter lasts for in my area. As do all ants that live in Canada/ northern US pretty much. There may not be any noticeable worker reduction out of those species if hibernated for shorter periods as well.

You find there is no “noticeable” difference between 3 and 5 months hibernation. Except the “no difference” could actually be the queen that gets 3 months hibernation lives 2, 3, 5, years less than the queen that gets 5 months. What I’m trying to point out is that it may not just be about how many workers the queen has at the end of the year. So even though you think there is no difference and therefore no point in hibernating over 3 months there could very well be a significant difference.

Edited by Joehostile85, March 18 2019 - 8:45 AM.

[TennesseeAnts]

Oh, ok. I totally missed that. It would make sense that it would shorten her lifespan by a bit. But she would still live for 10-ish years, which in my opinion is pretty good for an ant!

[Dukagora]

When you all bring a colony out of hibernation, do you do gradual temperature increases or more a turn the lights on and yell wake up type of situation? Gradual seems to mimic wild conditions more or less but I havent really messed with the temperature settings to see the lowest and highest ranges because I like my food when it is edible....

[TennesseeAnts]

I just turn the light on and tell wake up.

Edited by Ant_Dude2908, July 4 2019 - 11:00 AM.