19 replies to this topic

[Loops117]

Hey guys. I’m back at it again with an ID and not knowing what I'm doing.

 

I has this queen that was caught during a flight last year. She’s small 5~6mm in length. I originally thought she was Aphaenogaster but not anymore. She’s dwarfed by my A.picea queens, and her workers are half the size of my A.picea workers. She also has a slightly different shape.

 

Possible myrmica?

 

1. Location of collection: Nuptial flight. Northern Michigan. USA

2. Date of collection: Unknown
3. Habitat of collection Unknown

4. Length 4~6mm
5. Coloration, hue, pattern and texture Dark brown/red. Very course head and thorax, smooth gaster.
6. Distinguishing characteristics Unknown
7. Anything else distinctive No odor
8. Nest description Unknown
9 . Post the clearest pictures possible of the top, side, and face of the ant in question, and if possible, their nest and the habitat they were collected in.

 

 

I’ll get more pictures soon.

[Bracchymyrmex]

I'll start this off by saying I'm no expert, just doing my best to help.

 

After conducting some quick research I stumbled across this picture on Alex Wild's website:

It has the same coloration and nodes as your queen. 

 

Edit: He ID'ed it as a Myrmica queen. http://www.alexander...ica/i-6sKm2zX/A

 

Edited by Bracchymyrmex, April 3 2017 - 8:54 AM.

[Jaaron]

M. americana?

[Batspiderfish]

You can almost never ID Myrmica to the species without a microscope.

[Jaaron]

You can almost never ID Myrmica to the species without a microscope.

No doubt. Hence the question mark.

[Loops117]

You can almost never ID Myrmica to the species without a microscope.

That's what i figured. I'm going to see if i can get any better photos.

 

Thank you guys

[Batspiderfish]

There might be a lead if you can get a good image of the propodeal spines (preferable from a worker) and see if there is a clypeal notch.

Edited by Batspiderfish, April 3 2017 - 10:08 AM.

[Loops117]

There might be a lead if you can get a good image of the propodeal spines (preferable from a worker) and see if there is a clypeal notch.

 

I will get some new photos today. The problem is that they mucked up their tube big time and won't come out.

[Loops117]

Is their any different behavior i could watch out for? So far i'm good at keeping my Aphaenogaster picea colony and queens happy. Are myrmica pretty much the same?

[Salmon]

Myrmica are semi claustral.

[James C. Trager]

Definitely not M. americana, with those short propodeal spines and evenly curved antennal scapes. This may be M. brevispinosa, but we await images of the workers.

[Loops117]

Definitely not M. americana, with those short propodeal spines and evenly curved antennal scapes. This may be M. brevispinosa, but we await images of the workers.

I will have to get some better pictures. I attempted to get better photos last night but the visibility through their current tube is very poor. I started to switch them to a new tube last night and they were moved over this morning with just a couple workers in the old tube. New tube should allow for better quality photos. sorry for the delay.

 

[Jaaron]

Definitely not M. americana, with those short propodeal spines and evenly curved antennal scapes. This may be M. brevispinosa, but we await images of the workers.

Is  M. brevispinosa not a sub of M. americana? 

[T.C.]

Definitely not M. americana, with those short propodeal spines and evenly curved antennal scapes. This may be M. brevispinosa, but we await images of the workers.

I will have to get some better pictures. I attempted to get better photos last night but the visibility through their current tube is very poor. I started to switch them to a new tube last night and they were moved over this morning with just a couple workers in the old tube. New tube should allow for better quality photos. sorry for the delay.
 

Giving that formisazine, a try huh? I am excited to see if it works well, so I can get some.

[Loops117]

Ok guys. Transfer was finished and i was able to take some photos of the colony.

They're not the best, but they should work. Tell me what you think.

[Batspiderfish]

This propodeal spines are pretty small, and there *may be* a clypeal notch. These features would not confirm Myrmica brevispinosa, even if they were both visible, but this is at least a lead for you or somebody else to investigate at a later time, with a dead worker and a microscope. DoctorAnt might be able to eyeball them, who knows.

Edited by Batspiderfish, April 6 2017 - 6:59 AM.

[Loops117]

This propodeal spines are pretty small, and there *may be* a clypeal notch. These features would not confirm Myrmica brevispinosa, even if they were both visible, but this is at least a lead for you or somebody else to investigate at a later time, with a dead worker and a microscope. DoctorAnt might be able to eyeball them, who knows.

 

Buuut, would you be able to tell me if they're Myrmica or Aphaenogaster?

If so, how are you able to tell the difference? I looked at some of the drawings and i can't make much sense of them when comparing them to my photos.

[Batspiderfish]

 

This propodeal spines are pretty small, and there *may be* a clypeal notch. These features would not confirm Myrmica brevispinosa, even if they were both visible, but this is at least a lead for you or somebody else to investigate at a later time, with a dead worker and a microscope. DoctorAnt might be able to eyeball them, who knows.

 

Buuut, would you be able to tell me if they're Myrmica or Aphaenogaster?

If so, how are you able to tell the difference? I looked at some of the drawings and i can't make much sense of them when comparing them to my photos.

 

 

Oh, they're definitely Myrmica. In my own, layman's terms, notice how, in Myrmica, the mesosoma slopes gradually to the propodeum, while in Aphaenogaster, the "waisted ant", the height of the mesosoma plunges dramatically just before the propodeum. It's a little like the difference between workers of Camponotus (sloped) and Formica (bent).

[Loops117]

 

 

This propodeal spines are pretty small, and there *may be* a clypeal notch. These features would not confirm Myrmica brevispinosa, even if they were both visible, but this is at least a lead for you or somebody else to investigate at a later time, with a dead worker and a microscope. DoctorAnt might be able to eyeball them, who knows.

 

Buuut, would you be able to tell me if they're Myrmica or Aphaenogaster?

If so, how are you able to tell the difference? I looked at some of the drawings and i can't make much sense of them when comparing them to my photos.

 

 

Oh, they're definitely Myrmica. In my own, layman's terms, notice how, in Myrmica, the mesosoma slopes gradually to the propodeum, while in Aphaenogaster, the "waisted ant", the height of the mesosoma plunges dramatically just before the propodeum. It's a little like the difference between workers of Camponotus (sloped) and Formica (bent).

 

 

So the "arched" back the Aphaenogaster and the "flat" styled back of the Myrmica were good indicators for a different species. That was the first thing i noticed about them.

 

Thank you very much. I will keep this in mind and include this information when IDing future species.

[Batspiderfish]

 

So the "arched" back the Aphaenogaster and the "flat" styled back of the Myrmica were good indicators for a different species. That was the first thing i noticed about them.

 

Thank you very much. I will keep this in mind and include this information when IDing future species.

 

Good indicators for a different genus.