28 replies to this topic

[thosaka]

I apologize to everyone on not giving a report on anting in Anza Borrego Desert State Park. I did not have computer access for a few days due to some scheduled house renovations and projects. I setup the computer today, 4/1/2017, and currently temporarily have it in the garage. This is my unofficial quick report on Anza Borrego Desert State Park on 3/28/2017. The temperature was around 75-83, I searched 2 long trails as well as 20 acres off-trail, totaling to 8 hrs from 12-8. I did not see any queen ants, but I did find very few colonies of ants, and I say a few, because I suspected they were all hiding underground, under the radar from the dry 80 degree weather, and because I saw without digging, many ants moving underground through a large opening. I took about 20-30 pictures I will post. Please give me some time as I have more work to do. Soysauce may have had better luck than I looking through southern California where I was at. He and I will share and submit our reports to the forum so the others can decide whether they would like to go to the same place during this time or in the near future. Before I left for the desert, I also made my first formicarium with pure grout and water (no perlite or anything) in a 1000 lb weight sustainable plastic. It came out perfectly rectangle and solid hard. I will also post a picture of this. Thanks again.

Edited by Tagassi, April 1 2017 - 9:27 PM.

[drtrmiller]

The title makes me think you're apologizing for being alive.  We're happy you're still alive.

[FSTP]

I'm not sorry you're alive, deal with it. 

[Subverted]

I apologize to everyone on not giving a report on anting in Anza Borrego Desert State Park.

 

I hope you know that collecting anything inside a California State Park is illegal and carries fairly heavy penalties...

[dspdrew]

The title makes me think you're apologizing for being alive.  We're happy you're still alive.

 

  This is one of those times when antdude is right.

[SoySauce]

I apologize to everyone on not giving a report on anting in Anza Borrego Desert State Park.

I hope you know that collecting anything inside a California State Park is illegal and carries fairly heavy penalties...

I'm just curious how do you know this? The reason I ask is because on two separate occasions at two different CA State parks, I've explicitly told two different Park Rangers that I was looking for queen ants. They both never said anything about it being prohibited, illegal or carried any fines. In fact they were inquisitive on how I find them and how do I tell they're queen ants.

I've also searched the CA parks websites and have not found anything about collecting insects are prohibited. I did find that you can fish and even hunt at some CA State parks and reserves.

Edited by SoySauce, April 2 2017 - 6:01 AM.

[Alabama Anter]

I'm not sorry you're alive, deal with it.

#savage

[Bracchymyrmex]

 

 

I apologize to everyone on not giving a report on anting in Anza Borrego Desert State Park.

I hope you know that collecting anything inside a California State Park is illegal and carries fairly heavy penalties...

I'm just curious how do you know this? The reason I ask is because on two separate occasions at two different CA State parks, I've explicitly told two different Park Rangers that I was looking for queen ants. They both never said anything about it being prohibited, illegal or carried any fines. In fact they were inquisitive on how I find them and how do I tell they're queen ants.

I've also searched the CA parks websites and have not found anything about collecting insects are prohibited. I did find that you can fish and even hunt at some CA State parks and reserves.

 

^^^^ 'nuff said

[dspdrew]

 

 

I apologize to everyone on not giving a report on anting in Anza Borrego Desert State Park.

I hope you know that collecting anything inside a California State Park is illegal and carries fairly heavy penalties...

I'm just curious how do you know this? The reason I ask is because on two separate occasions at two different CA State parks, I've explicitly told two different Park Rangers that I was looking for queen ants. They both never said anything about it being prohibited, illegal or carried any fines. In fact they were inquisitive on how I find them and how do I tell they're queen ants.

I've also searched the CA parks websites and have not found anything about collecting insects are prohibited. I did find that you can fish and even hunt at some CA State parks and reserves.

 

 

You told them you were "looking for queen ants", or "collecting queen ants"? You can look for anything you want. Collecting is what's prohibited.

[SoySauce]

That's true. I don't remember exactly how I worded it. But does that mean any State grounds because aren't they all managed by the Dept. of Parks and Recreation?

Regardless I never had any real luck at the State parks because they're too many people there. Other than the Chaney trail and campground.

[thosaka]

 

I apologize to everyone on not giving a report on anting in Anza Borrego Desert State Park.

 

I hope you know that collecting anything inside a California State Park is illegal and carries fairly heavy penalties...

 

Damn. I am afraid Subverted is right. I cannot go back to State Parks anymore to hunt for queens.

 

4305. Animals. 
a. Protection.  No person shall molest, hunt, disturb, harm, feed, touch, tease, or spotlight any kind of animal or fish, or so attempt.
b. No person shall injure, trap, take, net, poison, or kill, any kind of animal or fish, or so attempt, except that fish and bait may be taken, other than for commercial purposes in accordance with state laws and regulations.
c. Where hunting in a state recreation area or within the State Vehicular Recreation Area and Trail System or portion thereof is permitted by regulations herein, so much of this section as is inconsistent therewith shall be deemed inapplicable, provided hunting is conducted in the manner specified.
d. This section does not apply to activities undertaken by the Department in conjunction with its resource management activities.
(e. Feeding.  In units or portions thereof where posted in accordance with Section 4301(i), no person shall feed any wildlife or feral animal listed on such posting.

 

90 days jail or 1000 dollar fine....

 

It seems like there is no such rule for national forests so I may have to stick to national forests for now. I will call the state park tomorrow to double check with their rules. Goodbye Desert State park~

Edited by Tagassi, April 2 2017 - 10:25 AM.

[klawfran3]

 

 

I apologize to everyone on not giving a report on anting in Anza Borrego Desert State Park.

 

I hope you know that collecting anything inside a California State Park is illegal and carries fairly heavy penalties...

 

Damn. I am afraid Subverted is right. I cannot go back to State Parks anymore to hunt for queens.

 

4305. Animals. 
a. Protection.  No person shall molest, hunt, disturb, harm, feed, touch, tease, or spotlight any kind of animal or fish, or so attempt.
b. No person shall injure, trap, take, net, poison, or kill, any kind of animal or fish, or so attempt, except that fish and bait may be taken, other than for commercial purposes in accordance with state laws and regulations.
c. Where hunting in a state recreation area or within the State Vehicular Recreation Area and Trail System or portion thereof is permitted by regulations herein, so much of this section as is inconsistent therewith shall be deemed inapplicable, provided hunting is conducted in the manner specified.
d. This section does not apply to activities undertaken by the Department in conjunction with its resource management activities.
(e. Feeding.  In units or portions thereof where posted in accordance with Section 4301(i), no person shall feed any wildlife or feral animal listed on such posting.

 

90 days jail or 1000 dollar fine....

 

It seems like there is no such rule for national forests so I may have to stick to national forests for now. I will call the state park tomorrow to double check with their rules. Goodbye Desert State park~

 

National forests allow collection of insects. It's weird how it works, but you can collect in them. National parks you cannot though.

[Nathant2131]

I think Tagassi is the first person to ever back up their info regarding laws on ants...

 

Nice job.

Edited by Nathant2131, April 2 2017 - 10:59 AM.

[Subverted]

Here is a link for anyone else who wants to see the general regulations about California State Parks: https://www.parks.ca.../?page_id=21301and its worth noting that the MAXIMUM penalties are the 90 days and/or up to $1000 in fines. You would likely not be sent to jail for collecting bugs...but depending on the ranger and the amount you have (plus any evidence that you plan to sell them) its not beyond the realm of possibilities.

 

As far as I know all of these places are off limits to any kind of collecting:

California State Parks

California State Recreation Areas

California State Wildlife Refuges

California State Marine Reserves

California State Historic Parks

California State Natural Reserves

 

National Parks

National Recreational Areas

National Monuments

National Scenic and Historic Trails

National Wildlife Refuges

 

That might not be an exhaustive list...always research the laws that apply where you will be trying to collect things before you go. National forests should be good for non-commercial collection of bugs but if you plan to sell them you could be opening yourself up to legal problems (unless you get a commercial collecting permit from the forest service).

[dspdrew]

That's true. I don't remember exactly how I worded it. But does that mean any State grounds because aren't they all managed by the Dept. of Parks and Recreation?

Regardless I never had any real luck at the State parks because they're too many people there. Other than the Chaney trail and campground.

 

Chaney Trail is not a State park.

 

 

 

Here is a link for anyone else who wants to see the general regulations about California State Parks: https://www.parks.ca.../?page_id=21301and its worth noting that the MAXIMUM penalties are the 90 days and/or up to $1000 in fines. You would likely not be sent to jail for collecting bugs...but depending on the ranger and the amount you have (plus any evidence that you plan to sell them) its not beyond the realm of possibilities.

 

As far as I know all of these places are off limits to any kind of collecting:

California State Parks

California State Recreation Areas

California State Wildlife Refuges

California State Marine Reserves

California State Historic Parks

California State Natural Reserves

 

National Parks

National Recreational Areas

National Monuments

National Scenic and Historic Trails

National Wildlife Refuges

 

That might not be an exhaustive list...always research the laws that apply where you will be trying to collect things before you go. National forests should be good for non-commercial collection of bugs but if you plan to sell them you could be opening yourself up to legal problems (unless you get a commercial collecting permit from the forest service).

 

Don't tell them it's for research either. Hobby is the magic word.

[SoySauce]

Oh, I thought w the campground down there...it's gotta fall in under one of those things Subverted listed (which is essentially all open public spaces!). Regardless, if I accidentally get locked up, I'm may post in this forum for someone to bail me out

[Subverted]

Don't tell them it's for research either. Hobby is the magic word.

I've heard that you can actually get a collecting permit for insects fairly easily but that you need to get one from each National Forest that you plan to be collecting in (similar to firewood).

Edited by Subverted, April 2 2017 - 5:07 PM.

[Alabama Anter]

Hmmmm.... Does this apply to all states perhaps?

[Subverted]

Hmmmm.... Does this apply to all states perhaps?

Some states have more strict environmental protection laws (California is generally regarded as one) and some don't...but in the federally controlled lands I listed (besides National Forests and BLM land) it is usually illegal to collect anything.

[Antking117]

I just went to fontenelle forest yesterday (because there is where i can see all the nests opening to see if they start flying soon) and I know there is no collecting at all there. I've been to many state parks in my life all around the US and have encountered no collecting signs at I would bet every one of them.